Introducing Telsa Roadster... Again

This episode is brought to you by On Investing, an original podcast from Charles Schwab. Each week hosts Liz-Ann Saunders, Schwab's Chief Investment Strategist, and Colin Martin, Head of Fixed Income Research and Strategy for the Schwab Center for Financial Research. Bring your fresh insights on what's happening in the markets and why, and what the implications might be for your portfolio.

Join Colin and Liz-Ann as they explore questions like, how do you evaluate corporate bonds that look interesting and what sectors are on the move right now ? Download the latest episodes and subscribe at schwab.com slash oninvesting or wherever you get your podcasts. You know that feeling.

Too many updates. Too many meetings. Too many things falling through the cracks. Monday.com was built for that gap. The AI work platform designed from the ground up for people and agents to work side by side and deliver more together. Drafting the brief, flagging risks, running a competitive scan, your agent can do it all.

And the best part, anyone can build one. Even you. Try it. Create your first Monday agent today at monday.com. Support for the show comes from Jira by Atlassian. So your work is scattered, a thread here, a DM there, docs everywhere, and now it's not just your team hunting for context, your AI agents need it too.

Jira taps Atlassian's teamwork graph to bring that context together. across Jira, Confluence, Slack, GitHub, and more, and makes it easy to share it with the agents that you already use, like Claude, Cursor, and GitHub Copilot. Assign them work directly or connect your agents through MC P. The result?

Less token waste, more accuracy, and more time moving work forward. Learn more at jira.com. That's spelled J-I-R-A dot com. Like they have this metal key that actually sticks into the car and turns, which they got rid of in the 9-11. Oh. They have a lot of things like...

Wait, so it's a key? Well, it's not like shaped like a key. It's a key fob. The key is like a key. You just described a regular key. I realize what I'm doing. I realize what I'm doing. Yo, what is up people of the internet?

Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts. I'm Marquez. I'm Andrew. I'm David. Over at the producer table today, Ellis and Mariah holding it down. And we got a doozy. A doo... I tried. I can't believe... I typed it.

You read it. I appreciate you going for it. We got a doozy. A doozy today. Mainly because there's two gigantic things that happened in the last week. Right... Right after... That's funny. Right after we shot last week's podcast was a massive car event. Obviously, the Porsche Mission S event.

Oh, and sorry. Also, I think wasn't there another one? Oh, yeah. The Tesla Roadster. Toyota Camry event. The Tesla Roadster. And there was the embargo for Surface Duo Reviews is up. So we have been using Surface... I said Surface Duo. I thought you were making another joke.

I should have leaned into it. That's so funny. I should have leaned into it. My brain is... Anyway, iPhone Duo Reviews are out. We've been using it. David, you have yours. It's the blue one. The blue one. White one. The colors are... Here's mine. I forgot the names of the colors. They're like light sky and... Star white? Dark sky, basically.

Yeah. And we have our thoughts. The reviews are out and we can talk all about what it's been like to use them and daily these things. But first, did they even test this? Mariah has one. She said, potentially. I have a minor complaint. If anyone has a more major complaint.

That's what this is for. This whole thing is minor complaints. We've been getting bugs fixed for weeks now. This is great. That's right. I don't know what I did. And... Good start. So I don't know if I enabled developer settings or something in my Samsung. It involuntarily enrolled me in the new beta software for One UI.

And what that means is that I got one voicemail three weeks ago. And that means I got a notification. I have a voicemail. Every time I dismiss it, it comes back within five minutes. Oh, yeah. I have a perpetual notification that I have a voicemail when I do not. I've had this.

I've had this exact issue and it is a Samsung issue. The voicemail notification never goes away. I now... I'm trying to remember how I got rid of it because I think there was something about... I think you have to install like the visual voicemail app and then like read it in that app and then it goes away or something.

See, that would make sense. See, I didn't do anything. And then this morning my phone said, oh, it's time to update and you don't have to be in the beta anymore. And I'm like, that's what I want. Yeah. And we're so backed. No, I've definitely had that issue. And the fact that it's still an issue suggests that either no one's tested or no one cares.

I think notifications that don't go away might be one of the most annoying bugs in any software. Definitely. It happens in Slack all the time where there's like just the dot on my like dock on my computer or like it will say somewhere in the sidebar, like the icons that there's something.

And I'll click everything. That's another thing. I think that's a Slack thing. Yeah. All the time the Slack like the Slack app will have a little badge next to it with notifications and I'll go, oh, I thought I read all of them. And then I'll open it and Slack will be like, you don't have anything. And then I'll close it and it's gone.

That's a recent issue, I feel like. No, Slack always has issues. Slack's been doing that for a long time. Maybe my phone just started doing that. Slack will be like, yo, you have an unread mention. And I'll go and it's something that I've actively replied to like multiple. Like how is this unread? Well, you replied, you didn't click on it.

Yeah. So you gotta click on it. No, Gmail definitely has this issue too because it says that I have 9,317 unread emails. Yeah, you only have 9,315. I recently emailed you 9,300 times. So that's actually, it's gonna check out perfectly. Yeah. It's all spam. Yeah.

It's all spam. Well, I'm sorry, Mariah. I hope Samsung hears this and fixes it imminently. They won't. They won't. Maybe. Maybe. We did get one fixed the other day. I actually got the megaphone issue we had with the dropdown that showed every single post by minute. Oh, they changed it? They changed it.

And not only did they change it, but actively someone mess aged me and said, hey, I brought this to the attention of people. And they said, but they were already working on it. So. I'm taking credit. We're taking credit. Were they? We did this. There was the Google Maps thing where it started showing the speed before you would even leave.

You got that changed. Android Auto. Yeah. Android Auto. I feel. I think we need the, you know. There's the killed by Google website, right? Fixed by Waveform. We need fixed by Waveform. That's a good call. That's a good call. Well, hey, speaking of did they even test lists, what has it been like to live with the iPhone duo the past week and a half?

I have so many thoughts. There are so many big stories with it. One of the biggest stories with it is the app story, which is that, well, most developers don't have an iPhone duo. And they have had the ability to develop for the duo, but I think most of them like to have a physical device and would like to spend extra time with it to make sure their apps are perfect.

So the past week and a half of using it, and I think for probably the first two, three weeks of people getting them and unboxing them and starting to move into them, you will find that most apps have not been tested with it. Did they even test this? No. No. They are unoptimized apps.

Yeah. And that just basically means there's like a bar down the side and they look a little weird and kind of ugly and they're not optimized to use the space at all. But when they do get optimized, they look so good. And every time I see like new app updates available and I get another app that like checks the box for like Duo support, I get so happy.

Yeah. So as of right now, there's like three apps. The weird thing is that there are three states of optimization for Duo. There's like not updated to iOS 27 at all. Yeah. There's updated. A lot of Google apps. Yeah. Like a lot of Google apps. There's updated to iOS 27 and then there's 27.1.

Just 27 has like partial Duo support and 27.1 has like full Duo support. I barely consider it Duo support. I just consider it like kind of stretching it to be bigger. Yeah. Or like putting more of the background in the area. The Google Calendar interior screen one was the craziest thing I've ever seen.

Yeah. It somehow feels worse. Do you use Google Calendar? I do use Google Calendar. Have you looked at it on the interior screen? I have. I'm trying to think of what I mean. Yeah. Besides that. It's. And then it's. So we were doing it at the lunch table the other day.

So you open it. Yeah. And it stays the exact same size. Yeah. And then we were like oh rotate it. It'll fit that better. No. And the first time you rotate it it actually gets smaller somehow. Yeah. Because it's a vertical thing. I don't know. There is that expand button. There's also the rotate button. Yeah.

Which makes it wide. Which makes it wide. Which is. Now it went away. Yeah. See here's the. Here's the problem. I can't find the button again. Oh there it is. Yeah. It's a little rough. It's a little rough. I will say. So for unoptimized apps that are like fully unoptized.

Like Google Apps or RIP Arc Search. My favorite mobile browser. Which they will not update. So sad. Because Arc is dead. So I need to find a new browser. It effectively uses the iPhone 18 Pro aspect ratio. Well not aspect ratio.

But the width. Width. It's like the exact same width as the iPhone 18 Pro. And this makes sense. Because developers have already coded for that. But then you just get this giant black bar on the right. Yeah. And it looks pretty rough. And the duo is like. This is where I'd put the extra controls. If I had them. But it doesn't have them.

Yeah. Or just move the controls to that side. Exactly. It's tough with Google Calendar too. Because you have that plus button right. It's right there. Next to the black bar. And it's covering things. And it's like. Yeah. If this was moved over 40 pixels. It would be perfect. I'm also going to be honest. I don't always love having the controls on the right side.

Like it's a smart idea for reachability. But it's not where I always anticipate things to be. Even the dock. Like they put the dock on the right side of the screen. And I'm still. This is probably just muscle memory. But I'm still hitting the bottom left. Because that's where Pocket Cast always used to be for me.

Yeah. And then I open Telegram by accident. Yeah. It's a little bit of muscle memory. I do find it nice though. Because the unoptimized apps still have all the stuff at the bottom. That is harder to reach. Because it's further away from the edge. So the big philosophical idea with Duo. I guess if you haven't seen the reviews. Is basically it moves all the controls from the bottom.

Over to the side. Yeah. Moves all the controls from the top. Also over to the side. And that includes like your time. And your cell signal. And your status. The grouping of the status indicators. Yeah. Can I ask a question? Yeah. Yeah. We're complaining about it being not optimized. Specifically on this.

But for other foldables. I assume this is a typical thing that always happens at launch. Or is this not true? Sort of. But also not. To some extent. Because they completely redesigned how the interface works on this phone. On the front specifically. Yeah. And the thing on the inside. I don't know.

That's what shocks me the most. Is like. There are things in foldables that aren't well optimized. But that Google calendar on the interior screen of that. Is like bad bad. Yeah. But like. So does this happen on the new Samsung fold? Yeah. So on. On these Android foldables. And a lot of Android apps are much better at.

I guess. Scaling to a bunch of different sizes. Because there's so many different size Android phones in the first place. So. iPhones have just been the same aspect ratio. Year after year after year. And all iPhone apps are easy to develop. Because all iPhones look the same. And so on Android phones.

Like this. Like this Z Fold 8 for example. Apps fill up the screen. There's no black bar down the side. And then they can have occasional weird hiccups or bugs. With like actively changing between the inside and outside screen. But then on the. The iPhone. I keep saying surface. On the iPhone duo.

It just looks like a normal iPhone app on the side. And then a black bar. Yeah. Which is a little bit more jarring. But. And it's a little more obvious when it's not well optimized . Yeah. But I think Apple's strength. Is getting developers on board with this sort of stuff over time. Yeah.

And so my like line near the end of the review is like. If you're still thinking about buying one. And you're like trying to decide. If you do buy it now. You won't get it for another two months. And by then. Way more apps will be optimized. And you'll have a better time. Hopefully. Hopefully. Yeah. Google has so many teams on so many of their apps.

That it's gonna. I don't even know if half the apps are gonna be optimized. And the benefit of this versus like when. Foldables were first getting launched. What. Eight years ago or whatever. Is like. They know they're just gonna have to make it for this one. That's like this. And it's iPhone. That's what's the benefit of.

Well. Making for iPhone. As long as they keep the same display size. As long as they keep the same display size. Yeah. Which I think they will. I think they probably will. I don't think they're gonna change that. Where like. Before it was Wild West. We have Android manufacturers all over the place. Making all these different aspect ratio. Ratio foldables.

And everyone. Developing was probably like. Oh my gosh. That's why. I already had to make so many for this slab phones. Yeah. This too. I mean that's why Google had to come in. And hyper optimize Android for flexible screen sizes. Because they just knew. Like there are too many types of Android phones. You can't hard code for every single possible screen size.

Yeah. My overarching thoughts on this phone. Is that. It doesn't really feel like a phone. Which is something I really like. It feels like a. Single task oriented device. Where I think of something I want to do. And I go do it. And I think that that has to do with the fact that.

One it's very short and squat. So it's like. Kind of a worse experience in that way. True. And then anytime I want the experience to actually be good. I have to open it. And the friction of needing to open your phone. And then do the thing. Yeah. And then. Physically shutting it when you're done. It feels like.

I'm onto this task. Now I'm done. I'm onto this task. Now I'm done. It's funny because I'm pretty sure. The way they want this to be marketed. Is you saying like. It's really bad at doing all those things. Like this is supposed to be like. Multitasking. Big screen. Lots of different things to do. Like use your phone so much for all these things.

And you're saying like. Oh. It almost feels like you're saying. I'm going to be less distracted. Because I'm going to have to think so hard about the things I have to do. That actually is what it is for me. For you. But I don't think that's how they would want to market this thing. I think they would want this thing to be like. This does everything you could ever want to do.

Be distracted. Beyond this. They're the ones that made a case that physically. That case is over the front screen. The dumbest thing I've ever seen. No I like it. I think it's stupid. I like it. That's like an iPad type thing. Like the folio cases for the iPad. They do the same thing. It's like. It's closed. And when I really want to be intentional about opening it. Then I have to like decide to use it.

Yeah. I do think that the back of this case is bad. So it only does this. But it doesn't do multiple angles. So when you have it open. Like yes you could do like. A FaceTime or watch a video like that. But it's really not good for. Wait I pushed it way further back. I mean you can do that. But it's still unstable.

Oh you mean like. Vertical. Yeah. The kickstand. For anyone listening. There's a kickstand. And it has one. Yeah. Good spot. Yeah. I had a similar thought with reviewing the. The hamburger style flips. Flips. With like the Z fold.

The entire Z flip for example. Yeah. You can't really accidentally. Just open your phone and start doom scrolling TikTok. Yeah. And that's. Kind of a good thing. Like I don't think they market it that way. But that's kind of like a nice feature. Where you. You kind of have this barrier.

Where you have to decide. All right. Like the outside screen. Just notification triaging. And just like making sure I see text. And then like closing it. I'm not going to doom scroll. Yeah. But if I like. Open the phone and decide to go use it. Then I'm going to go use it. Yeah. And the duo has a little bit of that. Because the outside screen is only five and a half inches.

It's a little squat. Yeah. It's not great for watching videos. And you can kind of still do it. But. Yeah. There's a little bit of that. Everything is much smaller. And it's just like not really a great experience. You see less information. Especially when it's not optimized. It's like a much worse experience on the outside. So. You can have a great experience if you open it up.

And then you do this. And then you're like. Oh I have an iPad mini. But on the outside it's like. So you have to be intentional about actually opening it. I think you guys underestimate people's doom scrolling abilities. That they won't use the front screen. I really do think a lot of doom scrolling just comes from like. The muscle memory of unlocking and locking your phone.

Just like rapidly though. You know. Without even thinking about it. You know. You saw the part in our video. Where Marques scrolls on TikTok. And Instagram reels at the same time. Yes. But like. You have to intentionally like multitask that way. Yeah. That takes several steps to like open it up.

Unfold it. Yeah. Open one. Stroll to the side. Open the other one. And then starts flipping anything. Assuming you haven't set up a shortcut for it. Yeah. That's true. I have found myself using two apps at the same time more often than I thought I would. Most of the time it's useful for copying information from one screen to another.

It's so good for that. Yeah. Obviously you can just multitask. You could just be in one app, copy and then swipe over and be on the next app. But it's just nice to see it on the left. One of the most useful ones. I sometimes get parking tickets because I forget to move my car because we have alternate sides sweeping.

And every single time I pay the ticket, I have to insert my bank info. Like my routing number and my account number. Which is a lot of back and forth. Seven to eight. No, I'm kidding. And yeah, it's specifically with like banking apps because they like black out when you're multitasking.

Yeah. I have to like really remember what it is every time I go. So I can have them both open at the same time and actually just type it in and it's much easier. Yeah. Or like flight information if I want to add it to flighty, that kind of stuff. All very helpful. Battery life, insanely good. You had a great battery life experience.

I had like a solid battery life experience, but it seems like you were having amazing battery life. And again, it might be because I'm just like not opening it as much. I'm using this booklet case. Yeah. And this might help because the screen's on way less of the time. It's like completely off when the case is closed. My other question about your use.

Yeah. How much, like what's your ratio of open screen to closed screen use? Someone asked me that on Twitter. I think it's about 50-50, but I don't know how much of that is the novelty of it being a folding phone. Yeah. Yeah. I was kind of predicting, maybe I'm projecting a little bit in my review, but I think at first it's very fun to open it up all the time.

It's very satisfying. You just like playing with the apps and stuff. And then like a month or two later, especially on the candy bar shaped ones, you just start using it like a regular phone and you have to remember that you can open it. And I'm curious if like I said in my review, you'd probably be like 75% outside screen, 25% inside screen.

We'll see how it turns out for people. Yeah. But my battery life was pretty good. Yeah. Like B plus, like six hours of screen on time, extra battery at the end of the day and all that. But a little worse than the Pro Max. But I think if I used way more inside screen, that might not be as good. Probably.

Just because it's more pixels to drive. No, on that point of like the candy bar style phones, Alex was showing me a photo on his Pixel Fold 2 or whatever it was. And he was showing me on Google Photos on his just front screen. And I was like, dude, open it up. And he was like, oh, that's so much work. That's like, why did you buy this phone?

The whole point of it is to open it up. Yeah. And like if you have a perfectly fine normal phone experience on the front screen, you don't have as much incentive to actually open the phone. So making it a worse experience on the front display does give you incentive to use the inner display. Yeah. Which I understand is a cop out.

Is really funny. I totally understand that's a cop out. I'm not even saying cop out. It's like so bad that you have to use the good feature. It's $2,000. I know. I do know. Like you mentioned with the flip before, it almost feels closer to a flip because of that. Yes. Where it's like the front screen is starting to be like the on-the-go usage.

And then I think people will use the inner screen way more if public transportation commute is part of your everyday life. Yeah. If there's lots of things you're doing like entertainment or whatever where you don't have to be in control of anything else, you can just be fully focused on your phone.

Yeah. Like plane rides, whatever. So that I think it'll be more. And then the front is just like reply. Do something. Check something really fast. Look at a Google map. Yeah. Then you're good. Something real quick. Yeah. I loved that it was really nice in portrait, similar to the Z Fold 8.

There's a lot of similarities between these phones, but I really liked that that phone sort of made that behavior feel more natural. It's like a small tablet in vertical. Yeah. And on this phone, this iPhone Duo, the volume buttons are on the side. So the sort of correct orientation is like with the cameras up at the top here, the volume buttons are where they would normally be on like a normal phone.

Oh, true. That's a great point. And touch ideas at the top. So it's kind of like a normal iPad set up here. Yeah. And I liked doing that a lot with the iPhone Duo. It is really nice to just have basically an iPad mini in your pocket. And when you're reading an article, you can just like read it on the display.

The volume rockers when it's closed are annoying to use. They look really annoying. Because you have to like wrap your phone around it and then just finding which one is volume down and volume up is very annoying. This whole thing from when I've seen Marques use it is like there are so many things that they did a good job of in terms of reachability by fixing it.

Yet then they still have a bunch of things on it that are a pain in the neck for reachability. The fact that the swipe downs are still right, middle and left for what? Settings, Siri notifications. Like if you're moving all the things to the right, then you should have nothing in the top left corner.

That's a pain in the neck to swipe. I saw hand gymnastics. Yeah. So like it feels like here's the reason why this is great. Ignore the reason why this over here is bad. We're going to forget about that. Many times it is difficult to like get your notification shade to come down because you accidentally just activate Siri instead.

Michael Fisher was specifically complaining about that to me. I'm surprised. His touch target was a real. I mean, see, it just did it just down Siri. Why is Siri not in a different place? That's easier to do like a hold the power button. It does still do that. Yeah. Wait, that does activate Siri. Yeah. Then the two thirds of the top left should just be notifications.

That would be nice. Like give you more room for notifications so you don't have to go all the way to the left corner. I think it's because they built Siri to come out of the dynamic island on the regular iPhones. So they decided to make it in the same spot on the Duo, even though the selfie camera. No, you're right. They should have changed it.

This is like you said, there's so many polished parts that they kind of overshadow how many parts it feels like they just straight up missed on. I agree. There's like a lot of things that they completely redes igned for this phone and there's some things they just didn 't. And like the friction between those two things makes the phone sometimes a little bit weird. Yeah.

There's a little more thinking. Yeah. I also will say that a lot of the hand gymnastics stuff is more annoying because the phone is slightly thicker, slightly heavier and slightly slipperier with the titanium like curved rails. I dislike the rails so much.

And I'm not an iPhone user, so I'm not used to like the slick rails. But the first time I held this, I was just like, oh, my goodness. I feel like I'm going to drop this. And then just to add on to all the things you said and the fact that it's a $2,000 phone you really don't want to drop . Yeah. And then the Z Fold 8, which is, you know, also basically $ 2,000, but it has it's thinner, it's lighter and the rails are flat and matte.

And it's just way easier to maneuver. Like I don't find nearly as many issues with like moving the phone around in my hand, opening and closing it. I love using that phone because of how easy it is to maneuver. And then, of course, it's Android. So you can like pull down from the top and it's all the quick settings and notifications.

So I don't have like the reachability to the corner issue. Yeah. So that's that's a big difference. And that's why I kept calling it like first gen feeling hardware in my review. I think a second gen iPhone duo in my dream world. OK.

In my dream world, it has like a silicon carbon battery and like an extra camera, obviously. But it also actually gets thinner, flat sides, matte and like makes even thinner. Yes. Oh, they can't put Face ID in if it's even thinner. I think about Face ID.

I know. All right. So the annoying part. Let's talk about that. Yeah. I think a lot of people are going to miss Face ID on the iPhone duo because everyone uses Face ID on the current iPhone. I 100% miss it on the iPhone duo. The thing about the touch on the fingerprint reader, this touch ID is it has a built in delay.

Yeah. Where you have to swipe and then touch or you can have like rest your finger there for like two whole seconds and then it opens automatically. Yeah. But you still have to like wake the phone before you do it. Otherwise, nothing happens. And so it just goes slow.

Yeah. And I wish it was way faster. I wish I could remove that delay. I wish I could just like tap it, wake it up and it opens instantly like all the Android phones. I showed that in the video too. Yeah. I, you know, and they don't do like Face Unlock without Face ID. That's their own philosophy. I wish they did.

Security stuff. So now it's like I wish it had like a much faster fingerprint reader experience. It's specifically very annoying on Apple Pay because you have to double tap and then you have to like hold it and then it goes, oh, make sure you authenticate with your fingerprint. And then you have to authenticate with your fingerprint and then you have to tap.

It's like a, it's like a four step process. But it's just like you hold it down for a while and it goes through all those one by one, but slowly. I think that's a feature because everyone who buys his phone wants the person at the cash register to know you're paying with an iPhone duo and you need to hold it out as long as possible.

Yeah. It's just, yeah. Face ID is just much faster in most ways. And a lot of people on my, on my socials have been like, just unlock with Apple Watch. Just use the Apple Watch. I don't wear an Apple Watch, guys. That's what, that's what they want. They want you to be like, yeah, everything's easier in our ecosystem, but I don't want to wear an Apple Watch.

Yeah. Can you tap to pay with this open? Oh, how much is that bacon and cheese? I imagine. Hold on. Let me, uh. I was actually thinking about that. I have a flight later today and my, I am for sure scanning my boarding pass like, like, oh no. That's like, have you seen the people who joke with their friends at the airport and they print out their boarding pass on like a poster card?

Did you guys see the guy who scanned, he put like QR code on his bald head and then tried to scan it to get on the train? That probably wouldn't work because your head's curved. But yeah. It did work. So a couple other things. I am, uh. I really like the apps that have been sort of optimized to just look like a Mac app, like Slack.

Slack needs a little bit more optimization. They actually tweeted at me today and said that they're working on it right now. Please. Can you tweet at them for a couple other things that I have issues with? Well, let's just use it as they, did they even test this and maybe we'll get fixed. But it looks just like the Mac app where it's got like all your conversations on the side and then it's got the main, the main thing right here.

Same with like Apple messages. You have like all of your contacts here with the actual text here. I think that's awesome. And because of this, I really want the accessory ecosystem for this thing to get crazy. So I can like have it, you know, sitting on a desk and use it with like a little mini keyboard that's specifically made for this.

Can I ask you really quick? So in Apple messages, it has like your contacts on the left and the message on the right. Yeah. Can you press in the, where you type? What does the keyboard look like? It like pops up on the whole screen. It's over the whole thing. Oh, but it does bring just the write up. It does. I think that's fine. Yeah.

It just brings the write up. The Slack one looked really nice except for the black bar on there. There is a black bar on there. That black bar drives me insane. They will almost definitely be moving the bubbles on the bottom to the right side. Yeah. And they said they're working on it. So yeah. Yeah. So I really, I want all of the app developers that make desktop apps to just make the unfolded experience just like the desktop app, because then I want to be able to have my phone on a, um, on a desk and just use a little mini keyboard and get some work done.

If Google docs was optimized, please Google, please. Because Safari, what is Google docs right now? It's so bad. Please tell me it's one vertical page. It's the same as calendar. It's the same as calendar. It's bad. It's horrible. Something like Safari is actually awesome because it literally shows all the tabs at the top, just like on desktop.

Like a browser. That's cool. It looks just like a desktop browser. I just want if. And I want that for every app. I know we did. But if like a Samsung Fold did this or whatever, Twitter would be losing its mind. Yeah. I mean, I'm sure there's still parts that are. So like Android apps, the Android version like would at least stretch it out and scale it to fit the screen.

Yeah. But obviously then there's like extra work that Google can do to make it really take advantage of all the space. Apple is just kind of like turn it sideways. Yeah. Please. You're using it wrong. Yeah. You're using it wrong. The consumer experience is better for a second gen product because that's what I'm hearing.

You mean will be better for a second gen? Yeah. Yes. No question. Yeah. So I think that's kind of where a lot of the reviews landed , which I tend to agree with. It's a first gen product. So early adopters, tech enthusiasts, people like you and I who are excited about the fringe rough around the edges stuff, like the apps being weird, like that stuff we're willing to deal with.

But there's lots of other first gen products where you kind of learn from the early adopters and all that stuff. And then two or three generations later, it starts to find itself. And that's where it's good enough for regular people to buy . That's what iPad was. That's what Apple Watch was. That's what MacBook Air was.

And I think that's what my iPhone Duo is. It's going to be probably, hopefully, I'm fingers crossed, I think it will be really good in like two or three generations. Yeah. Fingers. I think second gen will be better even just because way more apps will be optimized. Yeah. A lot of this stuff feels like the typical Apple move of we made all of this polish.

We just, we don't use any apps that are outside of our own ecosystem. So to us, we don't see how there's anything wrong with this because we didn't, like everything Apple works perfectly on it. Yeah. And everything that isn't. It just feels like even though it's first gen in the sense of it's their first gen and we talked about how there's eight years of folding phones already, this feels like there's too many issues even as their first gen because of all the stuff they should be noticing from other.

There's still Apple apps that are not optimized. Okay. I take that back then. Pages. That looks terrible. That's actually surprising that they allowed that to happen . Pages. I agree. Yeah, but they still make it. I agree. I didn't even know there was an iOS. But if that's the barometer, because like Google has like 40 apps in the app store. Yeah.

Google is not going to update the bottom half of their apps that nobody uses with that same logic. So like, I hope Google Docs gets updated, for example. I really hope Google Calendar gets updated. But what about the like 17th like slideshow app that they make or whatever other random stuff?

Like maybe Gemini is first and then whatever else happens, happens. Yeah. We'll see. Okay. The camera situation is interesting. Yes. So the interior camera, as we've mentioned, has a hidden under display camera. Cheeks. What does that mean? Cheeks. It's bad. It's really bad.

Cheeks. Okay. I don't know if I've heard that. It's ass. It's bad. It's cheeks. I think I've heard Miles say that, but I didn't know what that meant. It's four megapixels. Oh. Is it really? Yeah. And it looks like it. It looks worse than that. Okay. That's true. That's true. That's four million pixels.

Yeah. That's four million. That's four X the Dyson toothbrush. Yeah. Four X the Dyson toothbrush. Sorry. I should rephrase. It is four million pixels. We're really used to way more pixels than that, though. Yeah. It also looks like it's shooting through a lattice fence. Which it kind of is. It is. Yeah. It literally is. And if it was Google Photos, they could just remove the fence.

So, okay. A couple of things. Yeah. Callback? They call it the FaceTime camera on purpose. That's because in FaceTime, it actually looks pretty good. Because they're doing video processing. They do video processing on it that kind of removes that pretty well. And it looks very decent.

It definitely has a little bit of halation and like glow because of the way the light's being bent around those lattices. Yeah. But overall, like when you take a photo with it, it looks like cheeks. Yeah. As you would say. If there's a light source in this photo, it's like. Anything behind you. I'm holding it up me and it's like.

See. It's pretty bad. And then this little light behind me peers out. It's glowing. God is shining. It's like a pastel 800T. Take a photo. And now look at the photo. It's so funny. I don't know where to look. The post processing is way worse. Oh my. It's terrible. Yeah.

That looks terrible in the preview. And then in the actual. Zoom in at all. Zoom in at all. And you're just like. Oh. I mean, yeah. It's bad. And we're in a very well list. This looks like someone hacked my camera on my laptop in the middle of the podcast. And like. Yeah. But as you'll notice, the preview is actually pretty decent .

And that's because like the video processing they're doing is okay. That's so funny. Yeah. So there's that. The rear camera is definitely worse than the 18 Pro. I saw that across the board for sure. There's so much over sharpening. It kind of feels like the iPhone camera felt like four generations ago.

Like it's okay. Like in worse lighting, obviously it falls apart. And the ultra wide especially. Like there's no type of sharpness in the ultra wide. Yeah. But it still has the same look as the main cameras from like an 18 Pro. Yeah. The general like higher level of shadow detail and like the colors are typically the same.

Yeah. But the second you pixel peep, it does feel like an iPhone 15. The funny thing is that the ultra wide is pretty much the same quality as the main. And that's saying something because ultra wide is in the middle. Terrible. The ultra is good in the middle. But I thought at least in my experience. What do you mean in the middle?

Like in the middle. So I take an ultra wide photo. The middle section of the ultra wide looks fine. Oh, I see what you're saying. But then you look at anything that's not in the middle. And boy, is it noisy and soft. And that's fine. Like you're still getting the detail. That's what ultra wide. They're mostly just the utility of being able to see more.

Yeah. But yeah. It's the same ultra wide as on the 18 Pro, which is cool. But yeah. I mean, ultimately they want you to take selfies either with the front facing camera, which actually is pretty decent. Or. Or by flipping it around. Yeah. However, and they've like said you should do this.

And they did make it like a cool UI interface for doing it where you switch to selfie mode and then you pull it around here and slide to unlock, slide to show camera. And you can do that. You can see the photo you're taking before you take it. But holding the phone and taking this is extremely hard.

There's a lot of hand gymnastics. The natural thing you would want to do is probably do this. And then it's like, I'm going to drop this. A lot of hand gymnastics. I'm going to drop this. Yeah. The only thing I found it useful for was I put on the timer and then I did this and I took a selfie of me and my friend and we put it on my backpack and it was actually useful in that way.

Yeah. Other than that, this is extremely hard to do. And I would just recommend using the front camera. I'm so glad you said that. This is one thing that didn't quite make it into my video. It made it in a little bit. And I thought like if I, if I hammered on this for too long , it would feel like nitpicking unnecessarily.

But it's just, there's a lot of weird extra like hard to hold moments with the hand gymnastics. Like the camera control is the bottom corner. So if this is a righty phone like this and camera control is down here, it's a little thing. Like I'm about to spend five minutes on the pod.

If I did five minutes in the video, they'd be like, why are you still talking to us? Yeah. Yeah. But like this is like kind of a weird thing, but okay, you 're probably turning it sideways. So it's okay. Then the volume buttons are at the top and there's this extra shuffle that you do to like get there. Then what you're talking about, which is like you open it and then you flip it around and then you get the camera open.

And you have to switch it to selfie. And then you flip it over and don't touch the back screen. You might mess it up and then like slide. Okay. Now you've got the controls. Now you have to not touch the lenses and like hopefully get it like a photo set up, but now your fingers in it. So maybe other hand, like all this stuff. This is just a lot of weird hand motions and stuff with this.

This is why I want all of these crazy cases to come out because they're going to have like origami and that will make this easier. Maybe. Yeah. What are you going to say, Andrew? Do you know when like you're trying to take a photo and someone comes up to you and you're like, would you like me to take a photo of you guys? You're going to be like, you don't know how. No, not even know you don't know how.

Like I don't trust you holding this thing. Oh yeah. Like right now you're going to drop this or I would be like , just kidding. I'm not. Okay. Best case scenario. You set it up for them, right? So you open it up. You open the camera app. You turn on duo preview so that you can see that they're going to do it right. And then you hand it to them like this.

Never move. All right. A little higher. You can actually guide them. And then you can get the exact shot you want. Except now that somebody offers you and then they direct me for like 10 minutes. I was like, I was doing y'all a favor. Let's chill out here. Yeah. So yeah, I hope that they had a telephoto in the next one.

I wish they could have a bigger sensor, but that's just not going to be possible. I don't think. Unless they figure out some special physics. But who knows? Right now I'm like really missing the telephoto lens, but I also really missed it on the iPhone Air and that's just a compromise. Yeah. I think the battery is good enough that they can use extra room to add a camera.

Yeah. Like the telephoto. I kind of agree with that. Yeah. And they'll just be like, well, the A21 Pro is even more efficient. So there's even more battery life. Did you guys miss this? It has fusion camera. Yeah. I have seven lenses in my pocket. That's the other thing. And maybe they should have called it the Duo Pro or something, but they don't have Pro Raw and they don't have ProRes and they don't have it.

Well, they have ProMotion, obviously, but they don't have any of those like pro features on the ProPhone. And I understand they still have to sell Pro iPhones, but the Pro iPhone is half the price of this thing. And I just think if you make the most expensive thing you should make, should have all the features of the ones below it price wise.

So yeah, there's no reason they couldn't have done Pro Raw. They took it out intentionally. It's the same processor as the Pros. They should be able to do that stuff. You shouldn't get better features on a thing that costs $1, 000 less. Yeah. That seems insane.

That's a very valid take. It's just the, yeah, the Pro iPhone has to get the Pro stuff. I know, but it is a Pro iPhone. It's just not, you know. Yeah. It's like if you're the iPhone filmmaker in that specific way of being a pro iPhone user, then you obviously get the one with the better cameras.

Even though real filmmakers like 4x3 more than they like 21 x9. Yeah. It's also, are you going to edit on the phone or not? Because if you are, then maybe you do get the one with the worst cameras because it has the better screen to edit on. Well, I don't know. This is a better screen to edit on. That's what I'm saying. Oh, seriously. Yeah.

Yeah. Maybe that's their plan. So you buy the iPhone 18 Pro Max to film everything and then transfer it all to your iPhone Duo to then edit on the inside. Yeah. No one's editing on that thing. Oh, shit. I'm not going to edit on that. Somebody out there who doesn't, like there is a generation right now that does not have a computer that like does everything on their phone.

For sure. This is kind of sick for that. Apparently CapCut on the inner display is actually really useful because you can see the full timeline. You can see the full timeline on the right and then you can see your face. Is it optimized already? Yeah. Yeah. There's a couple. Yeah. Good on CapCut. Just a few. And I will say on optimized apps, developers out there, I'm looking for alternatives for a lot of my apps right now.

So if you make a good alternative to like popular apps, tweet at me or like email me because I will try it. I really want to find it because like. If you're optimized first, I'm going to try it. There's some that I'm like I use every day and I can't. It's just sucks. It's so bad. All right. Here's a take I want to ask you about that I've seen.

Yeah. A couple of places. Apple introduced this feature recently that is basically like the ability to hot swap your phone number slash data plan like quickly between iPhones. I forget what it's called. Handoff. Yeah. And I saw people saying that they launched this around the Duo or the Air or whatever in the last year so that people could switch between a more experimental iPhone and then their main iPhone more quickly.

And then they own two iPhones and then do two iPhone stuff back and forth like a weekend iPhone and a workday iPhone. Apple doesn't live in reality. Is that is that a valid theory or what do you think of that ? I look I miss the camera features on my pro but I'm not going to buy two pro two iPhones.

One that's two thousand dollars and one that's twelve hundred dollars. Fair. Just look. But it's only thirty five dollars a month. Yeah. Think about it. You're. Yeah. You're an Apple executive. I don't think it's thirty five. You're in the boardroom. They're like guys we have a problem. We've saturated the market. Pretty much everyone who's going to buy an iPhone has bought an iPhone except for Alex.

We just could. Anyway. How do we get people to buy two iPhones? Yeah. There you go. I I don't I don't know about that. I mean it's a it's obviously a feature that is only useful for people with two iPhones. But then people were speculating on the timing of the release of the feature.

It's like oh this would have been cool with them when the mini came out because the mini I don't know people didn't want to like fully dedicate their life to the mini. But what if it was just like a like a daytime phone and then on like work day. But that's insane. Do you know what it is? It's like one inch diagonally small.

It's not even that small. But the fact that no one not enough people bought it and they had to discontinue it. They're like maybe more people would have given it a shot if they could have like swapped back and forth. No way. Do you remember the palm phone? The new palm phone? Yeah. That was like a one inch screen. Yeah. One point six. Yeah. But they it was the same idea.

It was like you had to pay Verizon extra money to have the same phone number. And you it was your weekend phone where you couldn't do anything. Yeah. It was the same idea. But like literally. Yeah. Literally couldn't do lots of things on it. Yeah. I mean you could because it had Google Play and Android. But it was. Yeah. What if we just like take the SIM card and we put it in the other phone?

Oh there's no SIM card? Yeah. I know. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know about that. The only thing I could try and think of is if like you have if your work phone and. Your phone happened to be the same but like you want to work phone to be specifically not the same.

It's a different number. Yeah. Like I. Yeah. So I feel like that's. Look I miss. I miss the camera features on the 18 Pro but I would rather just own this and then bring a real camera. Yeah. Yeah. The. The. The. The. The. The. The. The.

is this better for a creator than the 18 Pro? Some of the creators maybe. Fun fact, I shot the whole Tesla Roadster reaction video on the iPhone Duo. There were a few comments, maybe two or three that I noticed, to like, oh, what phone did you shoot this on? But there was 20,000 comments about the subject of the video, not the phone that I shot it on.

And I think that that's probably the overall theory is that if the story is good enough, if the video is good enough, it doesn't matter what you shoot it on. Question, did you shoot it with the back camera? No, that's, again, too much hand gymnastics. I just did my old trusty this.

You did it with the back camera, but not open. Back camera, closed, no viewfinder. Trust. Trust. Pure trust. Looks like it's facing me, must be facing me. Because I was in Montreal this weekend, and I took a very beautiful video of the fall foliage, but the bottom part of the screen just had my finger in it.

So I'm surprised that you didn't have that issue. Oh, I've gotten used to it.

because I've gotten a lot of the time.

Because of the positioning of MagSafe on this, with the way that the bump or the plateau or whatever is, it bumps up against the plateau constantly, and it's hard to get on the charger. And you can technically get it on there, but it doesn't feel like it fits flush on there. The other thing is my car, I guess this is not MagSafe, but my car has chargers that are oriented for 21 by 9-esque phones, 21 by 9 phones, and it just can't charge my phone.

That's good because most cars are going to have it more narrow because it doesn't want to slide around when you're trying, and that's not going to fit in there. Any wireless charger that is at an angle and has your phone sitting up at an angle that does not have MagSafe will just not work for this phone because it's just too short. I assume most wallets as well that are MagSafe will not fit .

Yes, and the battery banks. It'll be too big. Well, yeah, even if they do fit with the plateau, they're going to hang off the bottom and just look like hell. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, even Apple's own iPhone Airborne bank is just not going to work on this. It does not work. So Apple's going to have to develop new accessories.

Manufacturers are going to have to develop accessories just for the Duo. Wonder if they will or how many they will because does it sell that well? There's so limited supply. How many people are really going to have Duos? This is the other thing I wanted to talk about is that we made this sort of bet.

Which we will never. That bet is null because we will never be able to tell what happened. Correct. It is invalid because their demand was way, way, way, way, way ahead of supply. Above supply. But that's all we know. We don't know how many they made. Yeah.

So pre-orders are moved until January or February now. I've seen February. Some people are reporting they're getting them pushed forward after they had a long, but I still know plenty of people who are like, this is a February. Yeah. Within like 10 minutes, a lot of people got pushed to January and Apple is saying, I mean, Apple would always say our demand is insane, but it seems like the demand is insane, but also we have no idea how many they made.

Yeah. So we can't really actually see if my bet was correct or not. No. Yeah. I also think it could like lose some sales because people are like, I think so many people ordering this want to order this because it's the new flashy iPhone thing. And like there's a status symbol to this, but if you have it three months late and that's the person you want to be.

Yeah. You've kind of lost the, like it's nowhere near as much fun anymore. Yeah. And at $2,000, if you're willing to pay that to be the flashy like gadget, you don't want it three months late. It's kind of the crazy thing. Like you, you think about it again. You're like, wow, this starts at $2,000.

And then after tax and everything. And it's like, if you're already going to buy a foldable phone and you're already prepared to spend that money, then it's like, yeah, it's a great, I mean, it's the iPhone foldable. It's awesome. Yeah. But $2,000 on a phone is still an insane amount of money no matter how you slice it.

So when you could get a pro iPhone for $1,200 brand new, it's kind of like, it's a little difficult to buy a Gen 1 product. Yeah. Yeah. My favorite line in a review that wasn't mine was in the Verge's review. Neelai mentioned that every once in a while, he'd find himself going back to his iPhone 18 Pro to do something real quick.

And it was like a relief. Oh. And I felt, I felt that a little bit. What you want to hear? Just like the slab phone is the better phone. Right. For most people. It's the better cameras. For 20 years. It's been optimized. All the apps work perfectly. The battery life is great.

Like you're not making those trade-offs. You have all three cameras. Like it's just a better, safer, easier phone for most people to get. And it's just, if you want to be at that bleeding edge, then you will take the risk and you will clearly have a worse experience with some things. And then you get the satisfying other fun stuff that comes with that.

What is kind of exciting about this existing though, is that I think phones that are this size, or at least that are foldable in this way, are just going to go way more mainstream in general. Yeah. Because now that Apple makes this, I mean, all these Android manufacturers already make them, but the volume they ship is very low.

But I think that Android foldable phone volume will go up. And also now Apple is like, like they're doubling down on this, right? Yeah. So I think that the form factor of a phone will not be as clear cut in five years. It'll be like, there's this phone and then there's this phone.

I think that's awesome. Oh, that was one other thing I was wondering. Do you think that there will be multiple versions of the Duo in the future? Oh God, please no. You don't think so? I think we have a possible future. Like whenever certain cars come out, you're like, well, I know they're going to make a convertible version later, so I'm going to wait.

Like, is there going to be a Duo Pro? Like a, like one with triple cameras. I think it needs to last the two years, the two generations first and make sure it doesn't get killed and then we'll start talking about that. It would have to be like three grand. Yeah. They're not going to have any problem with that.

They're happy to sell something three grand. Interesting. I don't know. I don't know. Anyway, that's kind of the thoughts. You should watch the review. It's 30 minutes long. I really liked your comparison of it to Vision Pro of like, they did all of these things that makes this feel so high quality and so many things they did right.

Like how great the glass looks on the Vision Pro, how great the clicking experience was. Eye sight. Yeah. And then when you start using it, you're like, I kind of wish I had some of the not polished things because usability wise, they're just better. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, we'll see. Developers, developers, developers, and then second gen. We'll see how it goes. That's the whole story. That could have been an alternate title. iPhone, do a review. Developers, developers, developers, wait for the second gen. Get Steve Ballmer in here ASAP. Yeah.

All right. Techtober is a thousand years long. It keeps getting it. This is pretty quick though. Yeah. Because I think we've talked about it a billion times already. Pro and tell. Pro and tell. Really? I like, I thought that was an okay one. Every single one of their event invites is a really cheesy pun. I know, but this one's worse. They're all, well, it's sort of, it's clear what we're about to get, which is a new pro device.

And we seem to all be on the same page that the headliner will be a brand new MacBook Pro. You don't think it'll be a HomePod Pro Mini? I would bet Pro Mini Max. And there's also iPad Mini OLED refresh updates that are sort of floating around as well.

But I think the thing I'm interested in and what the invite kind of references is a touchscreen OLED MacBook Pro. Now, what will you do with a touchscreen MacBook Pro? I don't really know yet. Will it be pencil support or just finger support?

I don't really know yet. Will it be $10 bazillion? I don't really know yet. It has to have pencil support. It has to. It seems likely. But also, the iPhone Duo is just now getting a software update to 27. 2 that enables pencil support for a pencil that wasn't made for it.

And everyone kind of wants like a pencil made for the Duo instead of just using like an old iPad pencil for it. Yeah. Is there going to be a new pencil for a MacBook Pro? I don't know if I want to use the old ones for it. I don't know yet. I mean, I still think that they didn't even need to do the touchscreen and they could have just added pencil support to the enormous haptic trackpad.

Because it's basically the same price as like a small, the same size as a small Wacom tablet. Trackpad is interesting too. They should have done that so long ago. But the technology is different in a screen and how it senses versus like this metal trackpad. It's really good for fingers. I don't know. See, there's a lot of questions we don't know. It is hard to do pencil support on a screen means the hinge .

Like touching is one thing, but drawing this hinge would need to be. And there are rumors that there is a reinforced hinge to accommodate it. But like if you're doing a lot of drawing with a pencil on the screen, it has to be rock solid. Almost like a kickstand on the back in order to use this as a...

Is Tim the only one who uses a tablet to draw stuff? Does Olivia not use one? Does she too? So we have two tablet users? I don't know. I think I'm going to have to give it to them because like the main thing I've talked about this in videos before. I, there's lots of touchscreen laptops already. I never find myself using the touchscreen for anything other than a scroll once in a while because it just wobbles back and forth.

MacBook Pros are pretty sturdy, but across the spectrum of laptops, there's all kinds of wobbling hinges. So I just don't use the touchscreen. Yeah. But the newest highest end crazy stuff coming out, like these RTX Spark Surface Ultra laptops, they're all touchscreens. They're all like incredible, like tandem OLED displays.

Apple is going to catch up with that tech and they're going to offer it. But then like, why would I want to do it? They might have to explain that to users in some extra way we haven't seen yet. Yeah. Which is exciting. I'm excited for us to get a bajillion views for like multiple months.

Pretty nice. People want to know. People want to know. There's going to be a nanotexture touchscreen. I imagine there will be. Possible. Because the nanotexture on the inside of the Duo feels so good. Yeah, that's better. And there's some iPads with it now, right? I feel like I'm still stuck in the nanotexture of Pro Display XDR, which is like, do not, don't you dare touch that or else you will never, it will never be the same.

I think the same way. Like we had those Pro Displays, like nanotextures come a long way. Those early ones, horrible, never touch them. And then they made a nanotexture iPad. And I was like, oh, that's okay. And then we used it and we're like, oh, this is actually great. That's dope. And now it's on the phone, which everyone uses all the time .

So I think they can do it on a laptop. I still don't think this one's very good for touching. Obviously, it's not made for touching. But I'm pointing out my MacBook Pro, which has nanotexture. Yeah. So it gets dirty. We'll see if they do a different version of that. Yeah. One of the rumors is that they're skipping M6 Pro and Max chips.

So do we think this is going to be M5? Skipping M6 Pro and Max. So, yeah. Because we got M6 previously. Yeah. I mean, M5 Pro and M5 Max are A plus chips. So I wouldn't be surprised if it had those. So do you think this is going to be a MacBook Ultra?

That's like its own category? Or do we think all MacBook Pros are just going to be this OLED touchscreen dynamic island? Two things. One, I think it lives separately from the rest of the lineup. Okay. It's the touchscreen one. But two, they never call it what we think they're going to call it.

So if we all think it's going to be the Ultra, that's the only thing that they won't call it. Yeah. I don't know what they're going to name it, but it won't be what we think. Okay. But you think it will have a distinct name that's outside the, it's like its own SKU. It's strange because everyone's saying it's going to be called the MacBook Pro. I think it might just be the MacBook Pro and Pro is going to also include Touch now.

Yeah. I feel like usually it's just like an add-on. It doesn't feel in my brain like it's an entire separate SK U. Yeah. But it's also Apple. When you say add-on, you mean there will be like this normal M5 version? It will be like a touchscreen version? It's like a Dell XPS where you add a touchscreen. I don't think so.

I don't think so. I think all the Pros will have the touchscreen and just the Air will not have the touchscreen. Because I think it's also OLED. I don't think they're going to make an OLED non-touchscreen . Yeah. And I don't think they're going to have, what is this again ? Mini LED? Micro LED? I think this is mini LED. Mini LED and OLED.

I don't think they're going to have the same MacBook Pro lineup with mini LED and OLED, like two totally different screens. Yeah. Just to get touchscreen versus not touchscreen. Yeah. I think this, yeah. I think this lands at the top of the lineup above the current MacBook Pro. With its own name. With its own name. I mean, some Windows OEMs will like make multiple SKUs of the same laptop.

Like this one has OLED. This one's IPS. This one's blah, blah, blah. But Apple generally does not do that. I was going to say, that's Windows? They try to, yeah. They try to make it like simplified for the customer to understand what they're getting in general. Sorry, I'm thinking like a Windows user. I know, I know, I know. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah.

I'm going to, just because you guys are doing that, I'm going to say these are just the new MacBook Pros. They're just OLED with touchscreen. I think I agree with that, yeah. I think that would be nice. That would really be this like, the second half of 2026. Apple really needed a new differentiating factor for the MacBook Pros because the M chips, yeah, they're getting faster and they're getting better, but they're beyond what most people can use them for already.

So they need reasons to sell new SKUs. It's a hilarious problem to have. Yeah. The M1s were so freaking good. Lobster too buttery. Yeah. It's just like, stick with your M1 again. Yeah. Exactly. So anyway, that's next week. By the time you listen to this, it's just a couple days out . But also, that iPad Mini apparently might have a $200 price increase.

Yeah. Which, it sucks because, I mean, it's going to be a better iPad Mini, but I want them to offer a lower priced one, which I understand probably can't be a high-end OLED display. Yeah. But I just want a cheap iPad Mini. Like, that's a nice little computer option to have.

An iPad Mini and an iPad Mini Pro. Give us the, like, I love my iPad Mini. I kind of wanted that a while ago. Yeah. I wanted an iPad Mini Pro. And this feels like it's going that, although OLED, but possibly still 60 hertz. Here's my conspiracy theory take. Oh, they better not be 60 hertz. They better not do that.

Conspiracy theory take. Because the iPhone Duo is an iPhone and an iPad Mini, they needed to make the iPad Mini more expensive because currently it is cheaper to buy an iPhone Pro and an iPad Mini. And if they make it more expensive, it'll be around the same price. And then you go, oh, well, why wouldn't I just buy two in one?

There's no way that hasn't happened in an Apple meeting. They definitely have thought that. That is really funny. It's been in a meeting. I do not think it's the reason why it's going to be more expensive. Yeah. But it's also, yeah. Like, if I want, right now, if I want a 7-inch, 120 hertz OLED display from Apple, the iPhone Duo is the only way to get it.

But if Apple can sell you an iPhone and a high-end iPad Mini, they would rather also sell you two things. 100%. So they would happily sell that as well. Yeah. Well, we'll find out pretty soon. All right. Well, next on the podcast, after the break, we're going to talk about the most controversial thing that's ever happened in history.

I don't think the Mission S is that controversial. Oh, I was talking about the Big Bang. Oh, right. Well, we'll get there. In the meantime, trivia. All right, guys. Earlier, you were talking about Google apps that you think might not ever get official iPhone Duo support.

Yeah. All of them. I scoured the internet. And I can tell you that on the iOS app store, Google has listed 71 applications. That's a lot. 71? 71. I thought it was 40-something.

That's a lot. What I need you guys to do. Oh, boy. Oh, my God. Name as many? No, no, no, no. Okay. As many as possible. Write down just one, but one Google app. And whichever one of your apps was last updated the longest ago gets the point for this question.

Can I throw the same question, but a potential for three points? I'm interested. You have to write down three of the apps, but if any of your apps match one of the other persons, you lose. Now, three of these apps were updated today.

So don't pick those. Bug fixes and improvements. That's exciting. But not Duo support, unfortunately. Well, we'll think about that. Answers will be at the end, like usual. We'll be right back. Support for Wayform comes from Framer.

When it comes to your website, you shouldn't have to choose between something that looks and feels handcrafted and something that's fast to ship. With Framer, you can have both. Framer is a pro AI website builder for creators, teams, and businesses that want a professional site and care enough to get every detail right. Agents and humans work in tandem, so agents bring speed and scale, and people bring taste and judgment and control.

The agents in Framer work alongside teams to streamline collaboration on the same canvas, build custom code components, create and manage CMS content , optimize SEO settings, and ship everything all in one place. And the agent works in the same place where the real site is designed, managed, reviewed, and published.

Join brands like Perplexity and Miro and start building your website in Framer today. Learn how you can get more out of your site from a Framer specialist or get started building for free today at Framer.com slash wave for 30% off the Fr amer Pro annual plan. That's Framer.com slash wave for 30% off.

Framer.com slash wave. Rules and restrictions may apply. Support for the show comes from Jira by Atlassian. So AI is only as useful as the context it has to work from. But when that context is scattered across different tools, threads, and DMs, that means your team and your AI agents end up flying blind.

That's the problem that Jira solves. What's the goal tied to your project? What got decided last week in Slack? Atlassian's teamwork graph pulls all of these pieces together from Jira, Confluence, Slack, GitHub, and more, so nothing falls through the cracks. With Jira, you can actually share that context with the AI agents you already use, like Claude, Cursor, and GitHub Copilot.

Assign them work directly or connect your agents through MC P. Spend less time digging through endless links and DMs, less time chasing down what got decided and by who, and more time actually shipping. Learn more at jira.com. That's J-I-R-A dot com. At T-Mobile, the new iPhone 18 Pro is here with a big leap in battery life.

And you can get it for nothing up front. With so many reasons to choose T-Mobile, you'll want to talk about it. I heard at T-Mobile, you can get iPhone 18 Pro for nothing up front and get $1,000 off. Pass it on. Pay nothing today. No taxes, no fees, nothing down.

Pass it on. Hey Mickey, pass it on. iPhone 18 Pro has the most advanced iPhone camera ever. Pass it on. At T-Mobile, you can get iPhone 18 Pro for nothing up front . Pass it on. At T-Mobile, get $1,000 off the amazing iPhone 18 Pro with no trade-in needed.

With 36 monthly bill credits when you switch to T-Mobile on a qualifying plan. If you cancel entire account before receiving all bill credits, credit stop and balance and required finance agreement is due. Example, $1,199.99, iPhone 18 Pro, 256 gigabytes. Bill credits in if you pay off device early. Qualifying credit, new line, port in, and service. $85 more per month with AutoPay Plus taxes and fees required.

$35 device connection charged due at sale. Visit T-Mobile.com. All right, welcome back. Let's talk about the other event that happened between the last podcast episode and now, the new car. I want to reiterate there. Yeah. Between the last, like, there were so many comments last week that were like, why don't you guys cover the Tesla Roadster?

Why didn't you, I can't believe they didn't delay the recording. It was a Thursday night. To cover the Roadster. The podcast was uploaded before the event started. We released at 4 a.m. on Friday. By the time we finished recording, we would have been due. Yeah. Yeah. That being said, I did put a video out reacting to it and explaining all my thoughts the next morning.

But there are so many more things to talk about, and so we will. Tesla Roadster. Tesla had their Roadster event again, finally. The one that was delayed and then delayed again and then delayed again. It happened. It was October 15th. And it was pretty insane.

Where do I even start? So they announced the new look of the Roadster. Looks totally different. They've made a completely different car. And all of this talk, all of this hype about it being a SpaceX collab turned out to be true because that's the one thing that they demoed.

They had people attend in real life to witness the car drive up a giant half pipe looking ramp and then upside down and then flip off of it and do like a barrel roll and land on its tires and drive away. It did a huge jump over a bunch of Tesla products.

Kickflip. It was pretty crazy. Can you describe the car first if somehow you did not see the video in the last week? So for podcast audio only listeners, picture a mid-modern Lamborghini, not like the latest Lamborghinis, but like a Gallardo or not a Countach, but a little newer, like an old Huracan.

It's like a wedge-shaped car with like triangles everywhere . The headlights are triangles. It's a very like low poly type of like aggressive look. Like Cybertruck supercar. I think Cybertruck will get comps a lot because it's again very low poly and it's only one color.

It's just silver. That's what I wanted to add. It's only that color. I haven't seen any other color. Okay. I haven't either. Yeah. I was wondering if it's only silver and it's like the Cy bertruck route of like it's pretty defined lines. Guys, this is product questions and details. We're not going to know stuff about colors.

That's what this podcast is for. I'm just describing what I saw, you know. But yeah, then it's got these like pop down headlights and then at the back there's this huge active rear wing and then the back of the car has these exhaust pipes and fans.

It's an EV. There's no exhaust. Yeah. You're probably thinking, why is there exhaust pipes on this car? And that's because there are cold gas thrusters positioned all around the car. So I think the easiest way to understand this is there's four trims of the Tesla Roadster. This is how you can, you can go to their website.

Like they didn't, this is the problem. They didn't say this at the event, but there are four trims of the Tesla Roadster. The base Tesla Roadster is just the EV, 100 kilowatt hour battery pack, whatever rear wheel drive or one megawatt of power, which is 1300 horsepower. Yeah. Just a fast EV. And that was, we only found that out because of the interviews.

Some of the engineers did later. It is not listed on the website. We don't actually have any specs on what it were. We're just assuming it is car that looks like Roadster. Big shout out to Hagerty, Motor Trend and Top Gear who all asked lots of interesting questions of Lars and Franz after or before the event and like published their videos.

This is where most of my information comes from. So there's the base Roadster. Then there's the performance version of the Roadster, which has a fan system underneath. The fan system, if you haven't seen the McMurtry Spearling, is basically just a huge set of fans at the back of the car that are connected to the bottom of the car that suck the air out from under the car.

Creates a low pressure zone, pulls the car into the ground and gives it multiples of grip. It's great. Makes it corner really fast and gives it grip where other cars don't have because active arrow needs a lot of speed. Then there's the thruster version of the car, which has that and adds four rocket thrusters to the back of the car.

They're connected to a 200 liter carbon overwrapped pressure vessel that's sitting right behind the driver's head and holds about 100 kilograms of compressed nitrogen at about 10,000 PSI that can burst for about four to five seconds, sends you zero to 60 in under one second, and then it's empty.

Then there's the highest end rocket version of the car, which adds another double-sized 400 liter carbon overwrapped pressure vessel in the passenger seat next to the driver, making it a one-seater, and also adds six other thrusters around the car facing down and facing sideways for yaw control.

That's the one that performed the crazy trick that could theoretically jump or turn in midair. That one on their website says it's by invite only and is not approved for public use, obviously. Yeah. The thrust version is limited, and then the performance one you can just reserve.

Performance is 5,000 down now, 45,000 due in 10 days. Thrust is 5,000 down now, 245,000 due in 10 days. And then we don't know base or rocket pricing. Yeah. So all of that is pretty theoretical because, again, this car was announced many, many years ago, and now it's pushed to 2028 and still doesn't exist.

We saw that one demo car. They did a couple demos in front of people, in front of a live audience, but still. I sort of ended my impressions video of the event saying, look, fool me once. Shame on you. Fool me twice.

Won't get fooled again. No. Won't get fooled again. That's right. I obviously have been waiting for Roadster for a long time, and they do this big show, this crazy demo. It is no question an incredible demo and a really fun thing for people to watch.

And then the product itself, details just don't make it out . That's not even important to this thing at all. Well, hold on. You did leave out three really important details about the car from this. The first is that, and these are exact quotes, the car will be sentient.

That's an exact quote about the Roadster. That was a tweet later. That was a tweet later. Yeah. It will be able to perform all of those maneuvers autonom ously. So there will, in theory, be no control system for the Road ster. And at Tesla HQ, they are building a life-sized Hot Wheels track for Roadster owners to perform any of these stunts themselves.

In fact, the exact quote is, crazier even than Hot Wheels. Yeah. One other thing is, Elon said, on stage, live during the event, they just sort of like asked how fast should the top speed be, because they're sort of re-announcing all of the specs. And, you know, if you ask Franz or Lars in the engineering sessions, they're like, it'll go 230, it'll go 235, it'll go 250 or whatever.

And then Elon goes, I think it should be able to go half the speed of sound. Which, for those who are doing the quick math, yeah, that's 380 miles an hour, which no production car has ever done. And it'll be probably 50 years before another car, like, even gets close to that.

Tires can't do that right now. That's just not going to happen. But he did say that on stage. So yeah, where do we even start? I guess the main thing everyone's wondering is, why should it do that? Let's start at just the three demos. And like, in a vacuum, what the three demos were, they were impressive and also raised some questions.

Okay, so the fan car demo. That first one. Driving up this super smooth ramp and then coming back down because it's a fan car. Really cool demo. Not the first time we've seen it. The McMurtry Spearling that I mentioned earlier is a fan car that's been in development very publicly and on social media for a long time, which is also an EV.

It's also a super lightweight, incredibly crazy sports car. And they have literally driven it upside down before because the amount of suction that it creates is more than the mass of the car. So it can drive upside down. It's a cool demo, obviously. But like the practical application of that, if you watch the McMurtry Spearling videos, is that car has so much grip all of the time in a way that Active Aero can't that it can it

literally can snap like three or four Gs of lateral acceleration, which you'd never see from just tires. So it's really, really great. It breaks track records every time. It's kind of like a cheat code. It's insane. I think that's an important note, too, is track records.

Yes. This thing is, it's Active Aero underneath the car. It's suction. Like, these things can only be done on a track. And even still, the track has to be perfectly maintained. Smooth track. I mean, presumably it has mesh in a filter system to not suck up too much stuff.

But like, this cannot be used on an average road. Yeah, they're really loud. I don't know if you've seen the videos of the Spearling, but they're super. The fans, they turn them on. There's like a dial of like 10,000, 20,000 RPM. And like, you hear the fans spin up and it's crazy loud.

And then it just accelerates in this like 1.4 seconds, 0 to 60, this burst. And it's just insane to watch. But yeah, it has this like skirt system that drops down underneath the car to create like a suction area for that low pressure zone.

Yeah, like a pressure vacuum. So it's really, really cool. It's a science experiment we've seen in development. And it almost doesn't surprise me that like Tesla comes along with this like big pockets and is just like, oh yeah, we'll do that too. And then they just throw a bunch of engineering talent at it. And they're like, all right, now ours can do the same thing .

So that is the first demo that we saw. It's cool driving up the wall. Really tall. Like Ella said, a half pipe turned on its side. So it's like literally perfectly vertical and just sitting there. Yeah. And that was the first demo. And then the next demo, it does that again, except drives off the upside down part of the top.

As one does. Flips over and falls down. And you see all the cold gas thrusters shooting all over the place and falling with style down to the ground. If you just take what we watched at face value, then we just watched a 3,000, 4,000 pound object fly through the air and then land.

I almost don't even want that to exist on the street. If you've seen the way, obviously it will never exist on the street. It's not street legal. But like the demos that they're doing don't have much practical application. They're just sick demo, basically. So you can't jump over traffic.

You can't jump off a bridge to avoid the traffic on the bridge onto another highway overpass or whatever. You can't actually do that anywhere. That's why they will have to build some sort of a private track for rocket roadster owners to demo this thing because that's the only place you can actually use it. They did the demo hundreds of yards away from the live audience and gave them hearing protection because the thrusters are so loud.

It would be really, really hard to listen to that in person . Really, really loud stuff. So obviously not street legal. But I think when people watch that, they think, well, some fraction of people go, oh, that's never going to happen. That's never going to hit the road. But some other fraction of people think, oh, that's cool.

They can jump over traffic. I can't really get a gauge on who really thinks that or who just wants to make the coolest AI video on Twitter about jumping over police cars. They're all memes. Yeah, they're all feel like memes. The memes were incredible. The memes have been incredible. I wouldn't be surprised if there's people who think that singular thrust is going to be like street legal, which I don't I'm wondering how they're going to do all of this.

Are they going to have to geofence like these features? Because that's not something you can just be like, oh, it's illegal to use on the street because some idiot's going to do it. Like remember when David Dobrik launched the Model X off that like San Francisco. Oh, yeah.

That would be in the Pacific Ocean if it had like if they did the thrusters. Yeah. So like we can't let people out there even attempt to try and use this thing illegally. Dude, are you a communist? Apparently. I've seen. So there's different in the sports car world.

There's different levels of how restricted not street legal things have been. So sometimes there's a mode in the car called track mode and there's a little fine print that says do not use on public streets, but you can just turn it on and do it anyway.

Yeah, it's probably not illegal, but it's like not recommended and the car will like not have the liability because it told you not to do it. Then there's things like you might remember the W1 video. Cars are not allowed to have like things overhanging the back bumper. So if you do, you need some sort of flag on it.

Like if you're towing like some two by fours or whatever, you need a flag. So it had this big wing, this LT wing that extended over the back bumper. That's not street legal. You can't have it extend over the back bumper. So they gate that to race mode and then they gate race mode to GPS locations of tracks and drag strips only.

So you literally can't enable that feature on a public street, which is another version of this. There's all sorts of little stuff like that. Like this concept car had no windshield wipers, had no side view mirrors. Lars or maybe it was Franz suggested that you could like attach the windshield wiper whenever you want and then detach it whenever you want.

And same thing with side view mirrors. I talk about this all the time. I think that's one of those cases where you have to sell the car with the thing that's required and then you can make it user removable later. That's another version. But yeah, for a 10,000 PSI cold gas container behind the driver to expel a bunch of gas, I feel like they should really restrict that to not be possible anywhere other than a drag strip.

Yeah, that seems like the only place you'd use that. And then in terms of the like the kickflip demo. Yeah. Where first of all, that was the most real life Rocket League thing I've ever seen because it clearly was real. There's people there watching it. But like when we think of flying, we think of this like gradual takeoff and this like lifted.

And then as it's flipping looks really strange because you can tell so much of the thrusters are like calibrating itself mid flight to be like, OK, over correct, undercorrect, figure it out, land nicely, which looks like the boost rockets in Rocket League where you're like trying to direct yourself to the ball correctly.

Less like flying, more like I don't even know how to just like midair maneuvering. Yeah. And that I want to bring up the quote Ella said before. Elon responded to somebody saying that like you will be able to do this autonomously. My first thought in that was, is this only going to be able to be done autonomously?

The more I hear, the more I think so. I think this is going to be a party trick that you launch with your phone out of the way because there's a person inside of that thing, even if it lands perfectly. Even just the like jerking your head around, like trying to keep in there, even if it lands perfectly fine.

It's like an RC car. Yeah. That's that's like the most intense roller coaster you could ever imagine. And that's so thinking about like being inside the car. Like when you crash test a car, they have to like make sure that the roof of the car can support the weight of the car. And that's in case of a roller incident.

So if the car rolls over and ends up on its roof, it can support the weight and not across the driver. Yeah. If this car can jump 20 feet in the air, that means it can fall 20 feet onto its roof. Which is glass. That's I don't even know. The above shot makes it look like the scissor doors or whatever.

I don't even know. But like you'd never take the liability of having a driver in the car while that happens. Yeah. And then you think about like, OK, doing the flips and stuff and the way it's described by the engineers and all the things that we watched and the demos we watched were all autonomous as well with the flips and stuff.

The more you watch that, the more it seems like this is going to be a thing. Remember the Benny robot that we had, which does a little kickflip or whatever? Yeah. It's just a button that you press that can do the maneuver in the right environment. And you don't really have any control over it while it's doing that maneuver.

Right. And then it's over. Yeah. And you did the party trick. I think that's what it's going to end up being. Totally. The more I see it. I mean, if it ever gets made. Yeah. That's the other thing. But yeah. I mean, and it's still crazy to see that. I don't think any. I know it's going to sound like we're like absolutely poo pooing this thing.

And that's just because it's burned us before. But like. Yeah. It was really. I mean, it's probably the craziest demo. Yeah. It was crazy. We've ever. Anyone's ever seen. For sure. I mean, I actually was watching hockey and I just looked and saw all the Slack notifications going crazy and you guys were losing it.

I was like, I have to see this. We're too busy beating the Rangers. But it was one of the craziest demos ever. It's just. It's fine for it to be a crazy demo and to realize that this is a car that was supposed to release almost 10 years ago that literally is just doesn 't exist anymore.

There are. Now, this is also two years. Yeah. 2028 when this quote comes out. Yeah. Lots of unanswered questions because the event was basically like no information at all. But one of the bigger questions is, OK, so for people who bought the other Roadster, they literally I think Franz called it the middle Roadster, which is funny because it never came out.

But for people who like reserved that car, this is a completely different car. Are they going to keep the reservation? Are you entitled to keep your reservation? What what trim does that get you? What are the prices of the different trims?

Yeah. Right. And that even had like the the Founders Edition was like a special paint color that you paid more for. So. So what happened was with the Roadster we've only ever seen with with the middle Roadster, we've only ever seen red and white. And there's two reds that weren't there?

Wasn't there red and Founders red? I don't even know if it was a different red. I thought the Founders series was red and it was the first thousand off the production line. That's all it really got you. It was the highest end thing. And then we started to see like random tweets about like SpaceX packages. And we were like, OK, is the Founders series also going to include that stuff?

And it was like, just wait, this car is going to fly. And we're like, all right, whatever. So now that we have all these new trims like base Roadster, performance Roadster, thrust Roadster, Rocket Roadster. What happens to the people who put money down on the old car? What happens to people who put $250,000 down a decade ago on what they thought was going to be a 600 mile four seater?

And a Roadster, by the way, which means it has a removable roof. This one. I imagine they get the $250,000 thrust version. Maybe. I don't know. Are those people going to get emails of like, choose your thing? How is, you know, the line going to work of who gets these things first?

Like, are people back then? Which I would think of now, if you're ordering the Roadster now after that demo, you're potentially thousands of people late already from eight years ago who put their reservation in. Yeah. Who's getting what? All unanswered. Yeah. Yeah.

What's coming out first? Like having a limited version of the Rocket one has the best opportunity of like sell 10 of these in two years and then it launched. But now the other ones, who knows when those are going to come out. Tesla loves to have their base cheaper versions, put the really expensive versions out for a while and then you just never see a $35,000 Cybertruck.

Yeah. And I think Mark has sent an image to the Slack the other day. I assume from an agreement when you're signing up for the new Roadster that said, you understand that the Roadster is still under development at the time you entered into this agreement. So we cannot guarantee when your vehicle will actually be delivered or if it will be delivered.

Yeah. And to me, that told me all I need to know. Yeah. So. Yeah. This to me is. So we see halo cars all the time. We see concept cars all the time. This was just a demo. Whose target audience is not people who ever buy this car.

That's the thing. Millions of people are going to see this. Almost none of them were ever going to buy this car. The target audience is people thinking about cars, thinking about Tesla. And it's to try to reposition Tesla in people's heads as a super high tech company. Yeah. That has access to some technology that no other car company has, obviously with the SpaceX collab.

And then maybe they'll sell some of these and it kind of doesn't really matter. Right. It makes no difference to Tesla if they actually sell them or not. It's a halo car. Mission has been accomplished already with the marketing stunt. That's all we can rely on. Especially since they don't sell the Model S anymore. Model S and X were canceled because they didn't sell enough .

Yeah. This, by definition, will not sell as much as those cars. Yeah. So you can imagine where it is in the priority list. For sure. It's a halo. Yeah. So yeah. Yeah. It happened. And then Porsche released another thing too. Is it even a halo? Really? When I say halo, I mean like it's what they want people to think about when they think about the brand.

Yeah. Okay. Not the highest. Yeah. It was the best marketing. It's not like other halo cars though where like you can buy them, you know? Well, there's a lot of halo. That's the thing that's tricky is a lot of these crazy brands have halo cars that are essentially unbuyable.

You will never see one in the street. A McLaren W1, that's their new halo car, we're never going to see one again. Yeah. Now they'll make a thousand of them or whatever it is and they will eventually, we assume, technically make all of these.

A lot of them will sit in garages. They'll hit the track sometimes. They'll sit in collections and that's their halo car. But the cars they actually sell and move on volume are more important to the bottom line. But they don't move those cars unless they have the absolute apex. This is what we're capable of.

And here's a taste of the tech, here's a taste of that technology in the car you're actually buying. Right. You'll never see the Ferrari F80. Like Lamborghini, I'm sure has some crazy thing that we can 't buy. Porsche's just announced a new thing, which they will actually mass produce. But I was going to say to play devil's advocate, you know, you just named two halo cars that we will never see because they cost millions of dollars and they're made by manufacturers where all their cars are really expensive and super low quantity.

And Tesla is not McLaren. They're not Ferrari. But they want the image of those companies. But they're a mass production car company, right? So if you're going to compare it to other halo cars from mass production car companies like the Toyota Century, which is a super rare car.

I've seen one on the road. The upcoming Lexus LFR. We will see that on the road. We've seen Nissan GTRs like like these halo cars are cars that like fundamentally exist and also push a lot of technological boundaries. Yeah, it's it's kind of like trying to shift their brand image.

So like Nissan, Toyota, Honda, a lot of these companies, they're not necessarily selling performance cars to the masses based on their reputation as like winning Le Mans or like having the highest end best Formula One team. And if you want to move from being Tesla and selling, you know, an average like mass produced EV to being able to eventually sell more or have this higher status image, you got to kind of convince people you have that technology, convince people you have some special

sauce. And I guess connecting the dots to SpaceX is them trying to convince people they have that, which how else would they do it, I guess. And that's the other thing. The end of the Hagerty video, I think, made a really good point. So shout out to Henry Ketchpole for making the point, which is so they they redesigned the Roadster Roadster to it's red.

I think all of us agree that's like a prettier car, like a better looking car, just like a normal looking EV. I thought it looked good. I get why they made it like it looks really good then. But I think, yeah, it's so as flashy. This is flashy. Yeah. So they announced that car. They show all the specs.

They show all this range and all this performance is zero to 60 in under two seconds. Right. And then they go. But it's coming out in four years. So wait a while. And then we wait a while. And a couple of years go by and we start to see that happen in other places.

Like Lucid makes a one point nine seconds or a 60 car. Ramac makes a one point nine seconds or a 60 car. McMurtry Spearling shows up, has the fan car suction. And suddenly that Roadster isn't really like a halo car anymore. Like it's not really doing anything that we haven't seen before.

And it doesn't accomplish the mission of being that halo anymore. That's fair. Yeah. And so at some point between that 2017 event and now, Tesla decided, never mind, like we're not doing that. We need something else about Roadster to actually be a halo again.

And that's probably when we started seeing like tweets about SpaceX and cold rocket thrusters and, oh, we have a better idea. And they just never communicated about like not ever shipping the thing that we all saw. But they now have a thing that is interesting again.

I mean, you see the clicks. You see the people talking about it. Like it is now moved to accomplishing some sort of halo status, even though it again probably doesn't ever have to ship. And it probably helps that it looks kind of like the Cybert ruck because nobody else is going to make a car that looks like the Cybertruck.

So if you stick to that similar design, it's not going to like it's not going to not hold up. Right. Like to your point, the Roadster they announced in 2017 looks amazing. It looks like a car. And there's so many cars that look like it now. Yeah.

At the time, it looked very advanced, but now it looks kind of just like a car. Yeah. And so that nobody else is going to like make something that looks like it. And I think realistically, like normies are seeing this. Normies are not following Tesla closely. They're just like, oh, he made this car. Great. And like they won't follow that.

It doesn't come out. They won't follow like they change it in 10 years. Like they just see what it is now. And that's the impression that most people are getting. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's so dude. How dare you? How dare you not think this will be out by next week.

I don't know what any of you are all haters. I was trying to think of what technology. I'm going to I'm sure your Twitter has been an absolute mess. Oh, Twitter is going to be a mess. But that's because Twitter is full of there are so many people on Twitter who are have like a vested interest in Tesla success.

Yeah. Who hear any criticism of kind of anything Tesla related as hate, basically. So if I come along and say, wow, really cool demo. I don't think it's going to ship, though, which is, I think , a reasonable thing to say. They hear that as like, what do you mean you don't believe in the vision?

And Elon has landed rockets and caught them before. Like, OK, we know all that. But like, yeah, I still don't think it's going to ship. There's like a really hilarious tweet about like eight years ago, Marquez was so amped about the Tesla Roadster and blah, blah, blah. What changed? And there's all these people who have been here since who have been like following Tesla for a decade.

We're like, you mean eight years ago when he spent fifty thousand dollars, like eight years ago when we all got promised this thing and it's still not out like they've been burned before. I feel like a lot of the new the new Tesla crowd is the post Elon by Twitter crowd.

That's like a little more into it and didn't see the beginning of where it all also watch the video. Yeah, exactly. There was no negative video. It's just a balanced, thoughtful video. It's skepticism. It's OK to have skepticism. People are just like it's just social media.

People just pull shit out of context. I mean, the difference. Everything seem negative. I think I have a lot of respect for the engineers at Tesla who get tasked with these impossible things and who also happen to make like some solid cars. And so the thing that changed from eight years ago is Tesla was really different eight years ago. Yeah.

They were like ramping up and making this new thing called Model 3 and then Model Y. And he's really like, holy crap, we can make like a kind of a cheap like EV that's actually pretty solid and like really efficient, too. And like, oh, a front trunk. That's a good idea. Like they had lots of good ideas and we're executing on it. And then mispromise here, mispromise there, overpromise here.

Now it's eight years of that later. It's like fool me once. Like that's it's a different landscape. So that's why it feels different. I cannot stress enough. I have something to say. OK. I just I have two things to say. I have seven things to say. First of all, I just want to say I cannot stress enough how important it is.

If you're even remotely curious about this car, that you watch the entire 30 minute event in full, not clips, because if you watch it in clips, it might come across like, wow, that's an exciting demo. Wow, that's an exciting demo. Like, look at that.

If you watch the full 30 minutes, it becomes so abundantly clear that there was zero preparation done in the actual presentation of this. Almost everything they say is like so obviously either wing ed or there's a teleprompter. They're like, oh, we're doing this now. Oh, we're doing this now.

So just like zero effort, which is insane to me. And then you'll see the end of the event, which is one of the most shocking things I've ever seen a corporation do on stage, even for Tesla, where it ends with the crowd yelling questions at Elon.

What's the range? What's the price? And Elon just goes, let's do a kickflip again. And then dips. There's not even a sign off. It's like, watch this kickflip. I'm not answering any questions because this is not a real product. But the last time people yelled questions at him, he answered a bunch of things, which was really bad.

So let's not get nuanced. Well, I guess people talking about hardware versions with new autonomous things. And he essentially was saying stuff that wasn't they weren 't ready for. And it was either telling people like their hardware might not actually work with full self-driving. It was bad for them. Tesla has a they've had this for a while where they kind of have like a weird style of events.

Like we think we watch a lot of polished tech events where they're extremely rehearsed. And this is their 50th time doing it or it's prerecorded or whatever. But you watch car company events and they're a little different. They're a little more. Here's some music and we're going to roll out the car behind a smoke screen and the cool headlights and through the fog and stuff.

And like Tesla style is like we're talking to the nerds for a little bit. It kind of actually depends on who the target demographic is, because if it's just like a stock pump type of event where it's like, look at this cool thing , our halo product. They are all stock pump. But when they're delivering a product.

But think about the last like five Tesla events we've had to watch, dude. Like they're all like, oh, we'll watch. Oh, it was nothing again. Like Model 3 and Model Y. I remember those events where they felt the same in terms of like, what are we talking about next? Oh, here's a new slide. Like they had a lot of those moments, which was I think people found that almost like refreshingly.

Just here's the new thing. We're just being really straight up about it. But then they've not delivered. I mean, Cybertruck. So they rolled it out and then said it's coming out in a few years. They didn't really have to give a bunch of details. And then you start seeing that like fade where it's like people have questions again. How often do you see a tech event where the audience yells out questions and then the CEO answers them?

Like that just doesn't happen. So it is kind of a weird vibe. I mean, I don't even think it's a style. I think to answer you and what you said of like you said Tesla didn't put any effort into this. I think Tesla puts a lot of effort into it. And there's a common denominator in both of your theories on it that one person screws that up.

And that's Elon's winging it. No, no, no, no. No, no. Well, I think the perfect example is in the beginning. Franz and Lars got on that stage knowing full well they were pushing snake oil and were saying, check out our cool thing. I'm not saying that. They're just as culpable in this. But right in the beginning of it, there's a part where Elon just starts talking and the timer starts counting down for the demo he's about to do.

And they have to cut him off and be like, hold on, hold on. We're doing a demo because he's just completely winging. There's probably a teleprompter there for him. And he's just not going off the teleprompter. It's because they all Tesla wants to be the Joe Rogan of car companies. They think they can just like be cool, relatable bros.

Like, and we don't have to know anything. We'll just like get by on our like cool, casual, chill bro vibe when that's like not how it works when you're trying to like build products that millions of people will have to use safely and abide by America's strict security laws. There's a, I think there's a big difference between their like model three event and their halo product event where if you watch the model three event , which I think I remember pretty clearly, like there were cheers for the spec announcements.

They'd be like, it's a, you know, 280 mile range. And people went, whoa, you can do that for this price. And they had like this very logical, sensible, like, here's what you need to know about this car because they knew it was their mass produced car and that's the audience for it. Yeah. But for a product that is inherently lower audience, like people aren't really watching this, thinking about buying it, then they don't give those details.

And then they go way more over the top of like the fanfare and the look at this cool trick because that's for that target audience. Right, right. But there's also a world, again, just playing devil's advocate here, where if you're doing a halo car to be like, look at all this cool tech we have access to, you might want to, you know, express in kilonewtons or like pounds, how much force your fan system can deliver instead of saying, quote, it can suck the chrome off a tail pipe.

I think that was my biggest issue with the event was when I watched Lars and Franz in those three videos after the fact, they did talk like that. And they gave us like the 10,000 PSI carbon overroute pressure vessels. And they told us the 1.3, the 1 megawatt of power, the 1300 horsepower from a rear wheel drive car.

And even to the journalist credits, like they were asking questions like, so why is it rear wheel drive? And they would answer, we think it's a better driver's experience. We're trying to save weight and they would give like, we're hitting hopefully 1700 kilograms with this car. All this technical information, none of which made it to the presentation because the target audience for the presentation is millions and millions of people who don't know what that means and won't make a difference to them.

I mean, or even because Elon's up there might be like, I think we could go a little faster than that. And now everything they've just said is null and they have to try and fix it. Like, what do you think makes positions them better as a crazy tech rocket car company? One, uh, 1300 horsepower rear wheel drive, smaller, higher density power unit connected to 115 kilowatt hour battery with double cooling.

Or look at his kickflip. It'll also go half the speed of sound. Yeah. Like the snake oil bullshit that they say on stage. People love that. They eat it up. So that's what they do. Um, my last thought on this was this event feels like it all but confirms that the cyber cab bet is totally safe because no one, we're like, we're not even like, I mean, I knew already, but that is safe.

That is very safe. Cyber cab. There's so much focus on this. Cyber cab can just do whatever it wants. Um, it will continue to be geofenced. It will probably roll out some more things in Austin and maybe two other cities. Yeah, road taxi service is like a kind of a slowly expanding thing, but you are not going to buy a cyber cab this year.

Sorry. I'll see you on the, the life-size Hot Wheels track, Mar quez. Yeah. That'll be the one place that someday cars will fly. Allegedly. Hey, look, they can fly, but for only one second. Yeah. So, well, I greatly anticipate, uh, a bunch of clips from this podcast getting clipped out of context.

Yes. None of us should go on Twitter for the next two weeks. Yeah. It's a good time. I mean, evergreen, but we're to all my haters. Elizabeth Holmes is in jail right now for pretty much exactly this. And we're just like, whatever. Let's. When you look. That was the most annoying trivia.

In America, when you steal from investors, you go to prison . When you steal from regular people, that's just a normal day at the office. Clip that. We're going to hard pivot, everybody. Just like the roaster when it does a barrel roll.

Hey. Yeah. Thank you. So cool. Okay. Thanks, Mom. So, taking it back to the duos, there have been many iconic duos throughout history. Steve Jobs, Steve Wozniak, Keyboard and Mouse, Peanut Butter and Jelly.

Simon and Garfunkel. Simon and Garfunkel, if that's your thing. But, what iconic tech duo had a feature called Knock Knock? Simmer on that. Well, I've used that. Where is that from? I have also. Don't say it out loud. Oh, what phrasing.

Good phrasing. That's a good question. I know this one. I can say it again if you need to hear it again. Can you say it again? What iconic tech duo had a feature called Knock Knock? Ha! Great.

Great, great, great question. Okay. It was phrased originally too easy, so we made it a little more ambiguous. Perfect. I love that they're scratching their heads. This is great. All right. Well, I'm going to get a trivia point later. We'll be right back. Real innovation is powered by real people.

This is Amex Corporate. Trusted experts. Smarter technology. 24-7 dedicated support from day one to answer questions, help set up policies and approvals, and consult on spend capacity as your business needs evolve . Plus, on-demand resources help level up operations at every stage.

That's the trusted service you've come to expect. Built to simplify. Designed to scale. This is Amex Corporate. Your heart can tell you a lot about your health. Apple Watch Series 12 measures your heart rate every five seconds with the most accurate heart rate sensing in a wearable.

So your vitals app, now with heart rate variability, can tell you when something is off. And your readiness score can let you know when to rest and when to push. Hear the story in every heartbeat with Apple Watch Series 12. The features described are for wellness purposes only and not for medical use. iPhone 11 or later required.

Based on Apple-conducted study of heart rate accuracy, August 2026. Visit apple.com slash apple watch series 12. Support for the show comes from Google Gemini. You know that moment when curiosity strikes? You're exploring a new city with a family, and a sculpture catches your daughter's eye.

What is that? Who made it? With Gemini, you can snap a picture and get a fully interactive breakdown of its history, architecture, and even hidden secrets. Gemini is built for moments like that. Whether you're learning something new, solving a problem, or looking for your next favorite thing, Google Gemini is here to help.

Download Gemini, Google's AI app, or visit gemini.google.com to learn more. All right, welcome back. I was kind of joking, but not really joking. I actually do want to briefly talk about Porsche's car event that happened the same day as Tesla's car event.

It was the same day? It was the same day. Oh, wow. Which is really funny. So, Porsche also announced a concept car. See if you can spot the similarities and the differences between Porsche's style announcing a concept car and what we just talked about for the last, I don't know, hour of Tesla announcing a concept car.

Okay. Biggest difference I heard at the roadster. Well, okay. So, Porsche, just for a little bit of background, they do mass-produce cars, but it's funny. They are very much a sports car company that also happens to sell crossovers like the Macan and the Cayenne, like a family SUV type of thing, in much more volume, which specifically allows them the money to develop better sports cars.

Does that make sense? As like a business model? Mm-hmm. So, people know Porsche as the sports car company, even though most of their sales are actually not sports cars. Mm-hmm. Okay. So, for the longest time, a very, very long time, they have only made, really, two sports cars, which is the Cayman and the 911.

You've probably heard about these cars. The Cayman is their sort of entry-level-ish, mid-range sports car. It's very small. We had one, like, at GT4 a while ago. I don't know if you saw it. And then the 911, which is, like, their Halo highest-end sports car. They also have made extremely high-end Halo products with crazy technologies that you can kind of never really buy, but a few people could buy, like the 918 Spyder or the Carrera GT.

Kind of legendary cars. A lot of words, for sure. So, I mean, that, again... David's following. 918 Spyder, 1,000 horsepower, hybrid, convertible, like, super limited edition, $2 million car. Okay. You've probably never seen one. Correct. But, oh, my God, what a car. Okay, so that means that the highest-end mass-produced car that they've made for all this time has been the 911, which is a rear-engine car.

And they've made a bunch of variants of the 911. They've made this lightweight rear-wheel drive version. I'm oversimplifying, car people. Please have mercy. But they have an all-wheel drive hybrid version. They have a bunch in between. And they sort of range between, like, $100,000 new and, like, $300,000 new because they're high-end sports cars.

Yeah. So what Porsche just introduced is a car to compete with what a lot of the other high-end brands like Ferrari and Lamborghini have been putting out lately, which is this, like, $600,000 range of car. Oh.

Which has, you know, hybrid systems and way more power and all this stuff. And, like, they haven't really been competing because the 911 is the highest-end car that they've mass-produced. So it's the Mission S. It is a new design, which has a lot of, like, hidden cues of, like, the greatest hits of their old designs.

It is mid-engine. And they announced no specs at all. They simply showed the design of the concept car, the outside. They opened the doors. They showed you the inside. There's very few screens. They have a MagSafe mount for a phone.

But these really cool seats, this harness seat. And it's mid-engine. It's got quad tailpipes, these really cool headlights and DRLs. The back kind of has Luce vibes of this, like, car inside of a car. Because it's curvy? Oh, car inside of a car. It's like a curved on the outside and then another curve on the inside.

A hundred percent. Believe it or not, that's referential to another older Porsche that kind of had the same look and had some racing success. So that's, like, a nice touch for historians. But I agree. But it looks like the wing comes up. And then it doesn't look like that. It does come up. But when the wing's down. Yeah. Yeah. So they announced this car.

They show it off. They do not announce a price. They do not announce the engine. They do not announce the performance. They just said, here's the car. It's going to come out later. Trust me. And that's it. Can I ask a question? Yeah. Are Porsche fans, like, really mad at that?

Porsche fans are mostly loving this car. Really? Yes. I was going to say the difference here is I would assume most Porsche fans and, like, car enthusiasts would be really pissed off that there's not a lot of specs in that. And the difference is that I assumed they would be mad.

Whereas the Tesla fans were like, Fair enough. It's a kickflip. That's cool. Yeah. So Porsche has a reputation for making really good cars. So there is an expectation that Porsche will eventually deliver what they're showing us and that it will be really good. So I think people give them the benefit of the doubt in a lot of ways.

There's a lot of speculation of, like, oh, there's a fan on the top and this is probably cooling like a flat 8 instead of a flat 6. Oh, it's probably going to sound really good. It looks like it has a high... Like, we're looking into a lot of things thinking about what they might do. What's a flat 8 and a flat 6? It's the number of cylinders in...

Oh. And it affects the sound characteristics of the car a lot as well. So that's what the big hole in the top of the car is for? The big hole in the top of the car, you see the fan? That's where the guy sits. There's a fan on the top. You're talking about the back of the car if you go to the back. The front thing. No, that's a... Oh, the front of the car you're looking at is...

I actually don't know what it is. Actually, there is no front. They're like hood scoop on the roof. The scoop on the roof. Yeah, there's a hood scoop on the roof which just sucks in cold air from the front to cool the engine in the middle of the car. But he's talking about... But you're talking about... See back here, there's like a fan. No, I was talking about the hood scoop. Yeah, the hood scoop is cool. We love a hood scoop. The back of the car has a fan.

We love that. Got it. But anyway, a lot of the praise from Porsche fans is about the design decisions. Like they have this metal key that actually sticks into the car and turns which they got rid of in the 911. Oh. They have a lot of things like... Wait, so it's a key? Well, it's not like shaped like a key.

It's a key fob. You just described a regular key. I realize what I'm doing. I realize what I'm doing. It's like this metal thing that goes and you turn it. I am literally describing a key but it's like the key fob has a place in the car where it sits. Yeah. And obviously connects to the car and lets you...

It's like not quite push to start but it sits in the car and the car knows that you're in it. You can turn it on but you also turn it on by turning it so it's effectively a key. Can you also turn it without that? It's a key in reverse almost. It's like... What? Yeah. It's like... A negative key? No, look at it.

It kind of is. It's the chamber. It has a slot on it. It's got the key part. It's the key chamber. Indented. Yeah. It's a portable key chamber. But like they also did the thing... So in the 911 they famously in this recent generation got rid of the beautiful like analog tachometer with the real needles and it's just screens now.

Yeah. In this Mission S we're back to real physical gauges that like move out and separate and like have these beautiful lights behind them. Oh. super super intricate stuff. And the biggest complaint I've seen really is that oh gosh Porsche is making all the stuff we love but in the $600,000 car instead of the 911.

It's not accessible. But generally a lot of good vibes around this car which has no specs no price no performance claims no release date it's just here's the concept you love it don't you? And so people are not mad about that. Not really. It sounds like people are just happy they're getting the things back that they used to like before that Porsche took away from them.

Yeah. Well here's my other question is if it's a concept car don't most car manufacturers show off concept cars and then never make them? Yeah. So I think there's different levels of that. I think there's like the CES concept car which is like here's a thing that is really legitimately just a concept that we could make but we don't plan on it.

And then there's here's the name of the model. Right. Here's all the stuff that we've developed it's gonna come out. Yeah. Like so the Taycan before it came out was the Porsche Mission E concept. Oh. And it had like these cool wheels and it was their electric concept car and then a year or two later they ship it and it's slightly modified but it's the Taycan.

Got it. That's close. So that's like a different level of concept. Like they're gonna make the thing. Okay. Not like the Hyundai the N74. That one I got the vibe was gonna get made but then there were too many questions.

and then they say it won't. Yeah. That felt like it went back and forth like this isn't getting made and then everyone talked about it and was like oh no maybe it won't make it. They like switched their drivetrain claims it was gonna be like a hybrid and then they had something about it was gonna be a generator I don't remember what they were gonna do. It was yeah I don't remember. But it wasn't it was like gas or something or hydrogen nitrogen yeah something weird anyway that doesn't you can't buy that yet obviously.

Yeah. So yeah I don't know similar to Tesla no real information on the car other than a design on stage and some cool tricks like gauges that move it's not a kickflip but it's a cool Tesla's like ours flies different target demographic we reinvented the key very different target demographic like this one has like a very like an analog looking shifter it's not a manual car but it does have this sweet looking like gear shifter yeah totally different target demo yeah but it's not to be clear a halo car

it's a mass produced car above the 911 and they will still have crazy halo cars yeah I guess my question is are they taking your money for this now? Not yet yeah not yet it's not a warthog it's a yeah that's a big difference Tesla's taking your money right now Porsche's not announcing a price or taking your money right now doesn't have been taking your money for eight years yeah so I assume when you're closer to real mass production Porsche will announce a price they will start whatever allocation process they have and people will start to try to buy this thing

yeah I won't I like it a lot I won't I just want to sit in it it looks so good does it yeah I feel like in white I like the 911 they do this thing with their concept cars where they make them in white and they give them like white wheels and it's a little much for me I would never get it in that color but some of the other renders I've seen in other colors my biggest gripe is the door looks like just like it doesn't match the rest of the car interesting right like it has this

nice hard line and then the door happens and it goes away and it's this like shadow and then the line comes back on the back panel interesting yeah it would have been cool if they kept the line through the whole car yeah sorry I ruined it for you yeah never mind I don't like it anymore I don't want to play with you anymore okay but yeah that happened the same day and obviously was overshadowed on social media by the one that flipped over upside down you know under promise over deliver I'm gonna say that forever I have a feeling both of these are over promising well

Porsche's not really promising anything yeah just that it might look like that pretty much fair mid engine not that it goes half the speed of sound yeah the only real promise that gets people going is it lives above the 911 and like the 911 is a really high end car the roadster lives above the 911 when it's doing a kickflip flying through the air yeah anyway that's all that's my that's my brief car's corner but you know what is 100% real confirmed you can have it right now and I won't even

take a single cent from you my trivia point oh yeah there you go also everyone I see you tweeting at me that people have figured out how to get developer access into webOS TVs and are building their own little things that's awesome I'm working I'm doing it a different way at home I'll talk about it on a future episode but I do see that this exists and same with Android TVs I saw this morning that people were vibe coding their own TV UIs and someone made a Wii one oh send me that

I want to see that it's pretty interesting and I think I won't talk about it too long I think the thing that a lot of people are realizing is the way you do it it's a little bit easier on Android TV than webOS is that you essentially give yourself developer access over wifi so that you can hit the console from a separate machine and I think a lot of people ask Claude like hey get into my TV and let me do this and then Claude did it and they were like wait you can get in dev mode to my TV just by being on the same

wifi network anyway it's a little more complicated there's some other stuff like that we also didn't get to talk about the crazy the certificate issuing company in India for all my ICANN nerds that watched our seven secret history keys internet episode there was a really crazy piece of security key news that hit the internet yesterday wait really yeah the TLDR like I know we gotta do trivia and wrap up this episode the TLDR is like you know how there are those

certificate issuing companies that generate like giant numbers and then when you do your HTTPS it confirms that number and then you get the the lock and you know you're actually on the site that the DNS promised a bunch of keys got leaked from a major one of those certificate issuers in India one of the keys so the numbers are supposed to be like a hundred digits long in S and like 300 digits long in binary something like that one of the

one of the keys was four not four digits just the just the number four are you what yes what incredible anyway guys there are 71 google apps listed on the ios app store shoot you need to write down one and whoever's app is the least updated least recently updated gets the point i'm kind of

not sure if this is real oh we also didn't get to talk about the php vulnerability the drug no it's uh it's a coding language php that's i don't know how we cut around that it's fine the existence the existence of things is not promotion so you read me an app and i will tell you when it was last updated i'm very curious for these

so we gotta run it all right who wants to what is that an app that's a really good one uh someone give me one i wrote google slides google slides i just don't know anyone who's ever used it i feel like i like thought do i just go save and make sure i pick something that i'm right that like is real i almost wrote keep you know what it is business i almost wrote keep was updated yes google slides was in fact updated yesterday yeah i kind of wanted to do it when what was the most recent and i would have guessed google

play uh business software gets updated every day google play was not one of the most recent and really i wrote google duo google is not even on the app store anymore which is why they deleted it though i was hoping they just forgot to delete it i was gonna put inbox by google it's really gone whoa didn't it get merged into google meet i don't even remember mine might not be there because fi exists now no no no fi is different from fiber they didn't merge them no they did not okay maybe so marcus

you put but i put google fiber because i i don't know if there's an app for it there almost definitely is an app for it if there is an app for it means you win because yeah because i was one day and andrew was null well i also guessed google or duo because i was like oh is that what he was thinking allo is a separate app it's just meet now i think and it's gone too allo was yeah allo's also gone and chat duo lasted longer than allo allo was like their hangouts like replacement and hangouts probably been a minute hangouts does not exist

that's why i thought if they had 71 apps there's probably some vestigial apps that just sit around that was my guess i was hoping that maybe it was there for like some stupid reason i was gonna say uh inbox by google but i don't think that exists anymore can i search the list they closed it down a long time ago but i don't think it's on the app store anymore i need so i want to see are we talking about updated on the ios app store on the ios app store oh on the ios app store yes specifically

oh here's the here's this is tricky there's an app called g fiber oh that's not good yeah and it is made by a company called google fiber inc but it's not the same developer account as the rest of the google app so i'm i can't really tell like this is yeah i don't think this is google can i see this can you link us this list i'll take the l does that mean you win with an app that was updated yesterday that's what i was saying we should have just picked one let's go that's brutal damn we should have

both said keep oh keep i crossed it out i thought that would be updated like this year it was this year for sure but not yesterday i mean a year yeah within a year is damn i won the oldest the three oldest number three photo scan by google photos oh yeah that was a separate app yeah it still is a separate app november 21st 2022 it's still on the app oh my god it is still really good number two the gboard app what

yeah hasn't been i was gonna try it on the duo actually oh maybe on the iphone i bet you gboard on android's gotten updated a thousand times on iphone it was last updated may of 2022 that's crazy and the least recently updated app by google on ios is google cloud search last updated november 6 2019 i have no idea what that app does neither do they neither do they everyone who worked on that has left the company i guarantee you so david congratulations

on your point i'm gonna give a quick update it's like a participation award that's literally what i got that is painful yeah it's a it's a strategy i really wish i had done that i make stuff up question now i'm really i'm sorry guys i feel like i just name a couple apps that i didn't know were apps please that google has recaptcha is an app for some reason wait i've seen that logo a thousand times i guess it's an app that google makes um fitbit ace that's another fitbit app

just an app for one of the fitbits oh my god there's an app for fitbit ace oh is that like for kids which now google owns i guess i guess i own fitbit yeah yeah yeah uh google fi wireless is still here uh google tasks would have been a good guess google opinion rewards separate app no way yeah wait when did that get updated what do you do it in i don't know it's in there i have that as a separate i have that as a separate yeah you're right it is a separate app google my favorite and culture my favorite thing about that arts and

culture is great i that's dope all right shout out to museums my favorite opinion rewards thing is you'll get a question that's like have you been to any of these places recently and it's like seven things and one that you literally just left like i just got home from the grocery store it's like have you been to um like chipotle or ll bean or at the shop right i know you were just that and you're like there's like oh when'd you go the last month the last week have you gotten the ones where it shows you a screenshot of a google search you

did yeah yeah it's like you took that yeah well and but every time i do that then you press back to look at the other one and it disappears from no my favorite thing is every week i get one that says were you born in new mexico and i say no and then it gives me a quarter that's it it does it over and over again infinite money glitch it's infinite money glitch um guys so not much to update on the score david congratulations on your 17th point uh marquez and andrew you're just behind it's not even worth it incredible don't worry about it

it's not even worth talking about right it's your turn wow okay pity point party okay so my question for you is what iconic tech duo had a feature called knock knock you're supposed to say who's there oh who's there um entire guess is based off of marquez saying nice phrasing god i really remember i really remember the name of the feature but i really don't the

feature's named knock knock isn't it it's an icon yeah i just respect duo i hope i get this right because you guys gave too many hints but i'm probably just wrong i'm so close it was like i don't know this david you know it well it's too late now i hope i'm right i want to see yours oh never mind flip them around flip them around okay okay wow so wow that is an iconic tech duo because i am wrong i really thought you guys had this one

i wrote lingo like duo lingo and i thought maybe there was a like learn how to say hello in different languages by knocking that's a good thought that's a good innocent guess david what did you say i wrote the surface duo but i don't know i think there so i wrote this there's like an lg phone that had like a case that had a second screen on it and you could like knock knock on the outside and it would show it would light up and show you talking about the dot matrix case no that's htc all right there's lg had like a case that you could knock on the outside it would show you the inside i don't know

if it was called duo but it seems like it would because it's a second screen so like maybe that i guess not so i really wanted to give you an easy question i was really trying to get y'all some points this week oh and it better not be iphone we went too hard um does anyone have a backup i'm just is the feature to turn oh no that was like the thing i was thinking of like the tap tap to turn on the flashlight can you read the question one more

time what iconic tech duo chop had a feature called knock knock do you want another hint yeah can you tell us what the feature does i don't know it would give it away okay i would take a little hint give you another hint it's just gonna tell them what that is can i just we can give you just a different question well i don't know i want to know what this is what if you just give the hint and it's first person who answers okay if i say crazy this was an iconic popular video conferencing

platform google duo oh well yeah that's so funny that i almost i got it right on my first question okay i was gonna yes i was like he knows he's looking at me he knows i remember what it was what it was was that if you started video calling the other person they would see your feed on their screen before they answered yes david that's what it was this this is

tech trivia in action so it's like what facetime does now right no facetime does not show like if i facetime you you do not see my face so the way it would work is like if we had two pixel phones or whatever or anything with duo i would call you on duo and i would be like andrew andrew what's up andrew but i wouldn't see you you would only see yeah so it was like a one way before you answered you got to decide whether or not you wanted to answer no one ever abused that feature that's a crazy feature you're in a meeting and it's

anyway um okay i'm i'm taking control this the trivia has gotten out of control we got to return to our roots we're doing one more question i know it's a long podcast okay i need a point i need a point so bad we just gotta we have to take it back y'all all right one new story we did bam one one new story we did not talk about this week were the discovered vulnerabilities in the programming language php you don't need to know what php is to answer this question um php excuse me the php vulnerabilities affect lots of

services such as duple finky joomla and magneto excuse me magneto magento oh which one of those is not a real cms platform say them all again drupal finky magento and joomla joomla

that is drupal finky magento and joomla joomla j-o-o-m-l-a they are all cms platforms like jude law like the actor please please i'm gonna get this one okay uh unfortunately marquez drupal is a cms platform i does sorry david you are corrected as a cms platform

marquez you you are wrong yeah oh wait but is david right when he says finky i said uh you're both right when you say finky is not a real thing i made finky up uh unfortunately this does almost nothing to the delta meaning this is a waste of time no uh further from marquez yeah also closer to marquez yeah and i'm also farther away um yeah you know what's weird is that a lot of cms platforms have a lot of like double o's and u's in them or no

vowels at all yeah well no well i just most tech products yeah i was trying to give you a point brother i was really trying i i should have got that right it's all good read us out this podcast has gone on way too long as it is and ellis is hungry and wants lunch whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa who said that you putting words in his mouth yeah well thanks thanks for watching thanks for listening of course we will have much more

tectober is literally only halfway over it's insane well we have much more coming there's literally events next week it's gonna happen so stay tuned get subscribed see you then thanks for watching macbook ultra bye waveform is produced by mariah zank and ellis rovin department of fox media podcast network and intro outro music was created by vane so bingo

the nba's back on prize picks pick a shootout in the west and a boards battle in the east on prize picks you can make all the picks you want all in the same app and now prize picks is available nationwide so what are you waiting for download the prize picks app today and

use code spotify that's code spotify to get 150 dollars installing in lineups if you win your first five dollar lineup prize picks run your game must be present in certain states visit prize picks.com for restrictions and details purchase new carpet from the home depot and get it installed for free right now shop the stylish choices and simple pricing of carpet from home decorators collection traffic master or life proof with pet proof technology and

see for yourself why nobody beats our prices enjoy new carpet with free installation right now at the home depot offer valid october 15th through november 1st 2026 exclus ions apply for licenses see home depot.com slash license numbers you