The Worst Idea YouTube's Ever Had...

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Retention graph of the light. Yo, what is up people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts. I'm Marquez. I'm Andrew. And I'm David. We've got Ellis and Adam over at the producer desk.

And we've got a lot to talk about because it's still Tech Timber. Still Tech Timber. We've got a look at, a first look at Google Books, for real , for real. The new Snapdragon chipsets, a couple Apple rumors, and then some nutty specs for the OnePlus 16. I might cry. And then also some existential thoughts on new YouTube features.

Our favorite thing to talk about. I've thought about them so much. Yeah. Am I so much the hour car ride here? And he's ready to go off. Make sure you stick to the end. Every second of that car ride. Make sure you subscribe to see us take advantage of all of these sick new YouTube features. Yeah. At lunch, we started to have a crash out, and then we said, save it for the pod.

I screamed it from across the room. Yeah. Yeah. Shut up, everyone. But first, did they even test this? Did they, Ellis? Dude, I don't think so, man. Because this one, this one's been really, okay. It used to happen to me a lot, and then it stopped happening.

And then it happened to me again on Tuesday, yesterday. And it made me so angry that I was like, I'm going straight to the podcast with this. There is a weird feature in the Apple alarm clock. I'm pretty sure I've spoken about it on this podcast in the past, but we're bringing it up again because this is so, this is the, there's, I've never seen a bug that is more antithetical to the functioning of a tech product than this.

When your iPhone is in standby mode on MagSafe and the alarm goes off, sometimes the alarm does not go off. Instead, you get a notification on your phone, like a normal iOS notification that says alarm.

And there is nothing more infuriating than waking up an hour after your alarm goes off with an hour old notification that says alarm and no sound playing. Can I ask a question? Absolutely. Are you on iOS 27 or 26?

I'm not a beta. I don't use any betas. But 27 is out. It's officially out. It's a few days. So if you have updated your phone in the last week or two to the, to the. No way. And so it weirdly sounds like. 26. Okay. The other question is, so iOS 27, believe it or not, iOS 27 is the first version of iOS that you can independently control alarm volume and system volume.

Yeah. I would wonder if it's potentially you had your system volume all the way down. And in iOS 26, that means no volume volume for your alarm. And if it fixes when you update. That that's an excellent proposal. And perhaps my system volume down. But I do want to say it's not because when your alarm goes off, when your phone's in standby mode, two buttons appear silence alarm and snooze alarm.

That's not what's happening. My phone is just in the normal standby mode. When I take it off the charger and flip it. This notification. And it doesn't even have to be the most recent notification . Like I could have gotten text messages since then. Yeah. And what's, what's my theory is that it, because my iPhone goes into sleep mode automatically every night, like because of my bedtime sleep focus mode.

Yeah. Sleep focus mode. Bedtime mode. Yeah. My theory is that it silences the notification and sometimes it gets confused. Here's my other theory is I have noticed some mornings I can trigger this behavior on purpose.

And the way I do it is, and I'm still fooling around because not only, not only is it a very complicated, weird thing, but it happens the first thing in the morning. So I'm not there, you know, but it's like, if I've noticed, if I try to hit the snooze button and I miss and I just tap anywhere on the phone.

So I'm not hitting any of the buttons. I'm just miss inputting on the screen. Sometimes it will trigger this behavior. Yeah. Interesting. That is also something to keep in mind because some wireless chargers sometimes cause rogue touch inputs.

I've noticed. Very rare, but sometimes that does happen. Either way, to me, this is such like an apocalyptic scenario. For an alarm. It's like the worst thing that I've done. Yeah. It's the only job. Not just for it to not work, but for when I do wake up, for it to be like, yo, an hour ago, this happened.

It's just, yeah. I feel like it's a sound, it's definitely a sound thing. I think the fact that it's a notification doesn't mean the sleep or snooze thing didn't pop up. It just may have popped up so long ago that then went away. Right? Because I think if an alarm plays for long enough without anything happening, it will stop.

Will it? I'm pretty sure. The audio will stop, but the little notification will stay there. Yeah. So if like that comes in and then another notification comes in, will it not override the snooze part? We're in standby mode. So there's no notifications. Like the standby mode screen gets overridden by two large buttons coming up when your alarm.

One of them says snooze. So those buttons are not there. It's as if the alarm never went off except in the notifications. I'm wondering if you let an alarm run for long enough on standby mode, if it would eventually turn off, assuming that like a phone was left behind. Because it's not going to go off till your battery dies.

I have a question, Alice. Because your phone can be in silent mode, which is obviously the silent toggle. Yeah. But that is separate from like your ringtone volume. And in iOS 26, your ringtone volume was tied to your alarm volume. Wait.

And now they're separate. Wait. You can be in silent mode with your ringtone on? Yes. Yeah. That's what Marquez was saying. No. Is that true? Because I thought toggling the silent mode turns your ring tone off, but you can still have app sounds. I think it was system volume. See, I think we're all wrong.

It doesn't matter. It's funny because all of this is a bad. This is all bad user experience. An alarm should. It's shocking that iOS 27 is the first version. I'm trying to like. And also, I just want to say I am a audible ringtone person . Well, you deserve to not get woken up. I didn't know that. That's on you. That's crazy.

That's karma. I don't think I've met anyone else who's a. I don't even vibrate. Your alarm is tied to your ringer is what it says. Right. So wait. So that means if your ringer is off. No, that doesn't make sense. It didn't. 26 versions of iOS didn't make sense. I agree.

Maybe we should. So if your ringtone is off, your alarm in the morning will go off? Yeah. Yeah. It'll be silent. Just like your ringer. Wait, no way. Stupid. Okay, wait. The alarm went off this morning. I feel like we should. It didn't go off yesterday morning. And I didn't touch my ringer between those two. Maybe we should cut this little section. Because I'm not actually sure that's true. No, leave it at it.

Because this is proof that this is stupid. The alarm volume. An alarm is an alarm. Especially when the iPhone does so much to be like, yo, dude, I'm automatically making sure you're waking up in the morning. You don't have to set an alarm. It should override everything. You know what I'm doing.

I'm asleep and then I'm getting out of bed. It says an iOS 27 Apple lets you change your alarm volume independently from your ringtone. Even if we got some minor thing about that wrong, the general consensus here is that the alarm is dumb as f***. It should always override. I've had this fixed for 10 versions. My favorite thing about being a non-iPhone user on this podcast is learning things like these and realizing people live with that.

This is not California, okay? I cannot just roll into work whenever I want. That's true. That's what I've been saying. I'm trying to get here on time. That's what Marge has been saying. Yeah. Well. That's a good, yeah. Well, they apparently tested it enough to fix it in the new version, so you should update your phone.

Also, iOS 27 introduces a lot of other features, so you might enjoy it. Plus, you're on an iPhone 17 Pro. So, come on. Get ready for Apple intelligence. You could clear up your liquid glass even more. You got the new Siri? You know, you can ask what my address is.

I can ask what your address is? Yeah, if I've texted it to you before. You can tell us Siri that. Maybe I'll ask my... You can ask your alarm that? I can ask my alarm that. Sorry, I just thought of another, did they even test this, but I'm going to save it. Save it for next week. Yeah, save it for next week. Save it for the pod. Okay.

Well, something that we're not completely sure they test, because the rollout of this was kind of confusing, and we're still kind of putting the pieces together, even though we had briefings, is the Google Book. We mentioned this really briefly last week, because they had opened up an opportunity to let people know that pre-orders were coming for a computer that they didn't really talk about.

They just sort of said what the basic features were going to be. But now, they've had an official announcement for the Google Book varieties. The Google Books. It's all the ones we kind of expected. Yeah. Acer, Asus, HP, Dell, Lenovo. Yeah. A couple things. You know, we were speculating last week.

There were some things we got right. They do all have a glow bar. And it seems like the glow bar is actually RGB from some of the videos I saw. Although, I believe from what I saw, it only really shows battery level indicators right now as one of the things. But they're letting third-party app developers develop for it, which is really cool.

So, that means the sky's the limit. It wasn't just battery in our briefing. It had like a few different animations. Was it? I thought only the Lenovo one had different animations. This is what I wanted. This is why it's all very confusing. The way you can pre-order this and we still don't know is ridiculous. In it, yeah.

It's always a bit of a red flag when pre-orders go up, but like no one's ever really even played with them. They did have like a media event where you could touch them and play with them that I could not make. So, that's on me. But still, usually we have review units by now.

So, it's kind of strange. Do we confirm it's red? What? The glow bar? There is red in it. There is red in it. We do have the technology. It doesn't need to be in the same spot. It looks like it can be anywhere on the back. Some of them are like left aligns. Most of them were middle. They do all say Google Book. They all have a function and a G button, which there's a couple weird things about the G button.

One, I'm a total idiot and last week said it should be a Gemini button, but I'm realizing no, it's replacing the Windows key. It's the start menu button. And obviously, this is Google Book OS, so therefore, it is the Google Book start menu button. Yes, I did say Google Book OS because apparently it's now called Google Book OS, which is almost as silly as Google Book dot Google.

So, I'm pretty sure, you know how we named the podcast WTF is Google Book? I'm pretty sure I'm going to make it. I need to make a video that's like actually answering that question. Also name your episode. With this episode, it should be what the f*** is the Google Book times two again.

Wait, for real this time. Yeah. It seems to the best of what we can gather is it's this collection of five laptops that have some set of minimum requirements that are guided by Google to make them Google Books. They all run this OS that's not Chrome OS. It's not Android. It's Google Book OS.

It's a new OS. They're all thin and light. I think there's no number that they have to hit, but they 're all thin and light. They all have a glow bar. They're all premium material. They're all premium. And yeah, then there's some questions about do they have to start at 16 gigs of RAM or do they all just happen to? Yeah.

I think the lowest priced one was $9.99. So there's an $8.99, but Acer said that was only the launch price. Yeah. And that they're reevaluating pricing over time based on component supplies and other market pressures. So it's a great starting market price.

Seafood of the day. Yeah. Like fish. Okay. It's like cat to the day. The other real quick. $1,400. Weird thing about the G button is that it's the capital G for Google. And one requirement that it seems that somebody said in a video, I think it was the Android authority video is all keyboards have to be lowercase characters, which I don't know why that seems so silly to me.

Quirky. Is it because so you're not confusing now the button with the Google logo being a capital G or just like to me, it feels funny being like everything needs to be this like premium material and serious and seriously. There's a Google logo on my keyboard.

Is that the G? Is that the G? But now all lowercase just feels silly. Give them the option. Feels silly. Who cares about capitals? I don't know. Yeah. I am excited for this though. I am too. I want another kind of laptop competitor in the space.

And if it could be someone as big as Google that can just like burn money for a decade until this becomes a viable competitor, like sure. You assume it's going to last a decade. Yeah. Well, they said 10 years of updates. So at least a decade. They did say. They said 10 years of updates. It's still Google. They also said that.

What was it? Google one. Remember that? What was the free upgrade program where they didn't even make it to the next set of upgrades for people who bought it? It was the pixel upgrade plan, right? I forget exactly. They have too many names. Yeah. I'll try and really quick out of the five laptops that got launched, there are all of them have at least base 16 gigabytes of RAM.

Some were up to 32. All of them have at least 256 gigs of storage. Some went up to one terabyte. XPS is 13 inch. Acer, Asus, HP 14 inch. And the Lenovo is 15 inch. All of them have some sort of biometrics, whether it's fingerprint reader or face ID. Premium materials kept getting mentioned, yet everyone just would randomly name premium materials.

So I don't know if this means we will not ever see a plastic Google book. It seems like the goal is for them to be built well and sort of premium in their positioning. So I guess that sort of means they should always use Metal. I mean, I have to note that they have Chrome OS, which has there's Chromebooks now, but there's also Chromebook plus.

And now there's also Google books because Google books are not replacing either of these. Right. Which is really weird. And I think they're trying to differentiate this lineup from the Chromebooks. Yes, for sure. Because Chromebooks have the bad rep of being the cheap one . Even though they weren't. There were some really nice made Chromebooks. Yeah, which is why they had Chromebook plus.

Yeah. Which is crazy because Chromebook plus only launched like a year ago. Chromebook to me, like Chrome OS feels like the cloud-based operating system and the differentiating on this is like, it is a Android desktop experience kind of thing. With some AI, there's really not as many AI features as I thought were going to be in this, which I kind of like.

The four main ones I saw were, they all have Rambler. Good. Which is awesome. There's an AI-powered search function, which sounds crazy, but it really just means in your files management, you can search like cat picture. Right. And hopefully get pictures of cats. Yeah, there was a. I think that's good. There was one where it's like, if you have a file that's called like xa4792.jpg, but there's a picture of a cat in it.

You can search cat and it pops up. It's semantic search. It's great. Yeah. The magic pointer, which we did talk about because they did tease this last week, which is lets you shake your mouse and get AI features. It's like Google Lens, but with Gemini. And then the ability to create home screen widgets, which I think is awesome.

So those are actually four really nice AI features that doesn't make this feel like a, oh my God, AI book only. Like it does kind of feel nice. It's more of an Android book. For sure. That's the interesting thing about it. Like for those who are not around at this point in time, we used to have phones that you would attach to a laptop.

Like the Motorola lap dock. The Motorola Atrix too. Atrix. And you would basically use your phone as your computer on this shell. Now this idea is like, okay, dedicated hardware, but your phone is still like your primary computing device throughout your day.

So we're just going to have all of your files, all of your apps. Everything that you do on your phone is going to be accessible on this laptop. And it's also going to have like widescreen modes for when you want to have your apps, but bigger. So I think that that's a cool idea. And then they're sort of just sprinkling the AI stuff on top.

It's not specifically a Gemini book with Android capabilities. It's more of an Android book with Gemini capabilities. Android desktop. Yeah. Yeah. And a lot of it was like, it still has Play Store and all the apps are from the Play Store. Through that, there's a certain way, like it says, if things are like optimized for Google book, made for Google book, or just like better used in a web browser.

I think it's funny that they're all optimized for SteamOS. And then in that, you can also mirror from your phone. So there's something called continue on, which lets you between apps, just let you continue on between them. Or the phone mirroring just literally means if you don't have the app on your Google book, you can still use it connected to your phone and do that.

It pops up in a little phone size screen. Yeah. And you can do things on there, which is pretty cool, especially if you think something with a keyboard is easier. Yeah. I think a lot of this makes sense. It's funny because when they were making Android more compatible with multiple screen sizes, we were all kind of like, oh, well, it's a combination of one, they're making foldables.

So they want foldables of various different screen sizes. Two, they have like a Dex-like experience now where you can plug in your phone into a display and you want to be able to use like a Chrome OS type experience. But now the flexible display sizes makes a lot of sense because now when you continue on on your laptop, you want it to transition very seamlessly from your phone to your laptop.

Yeah. So making Android very flexible is in their benefit here. Yeah. It'll be interesting to see what this competes with because being premium, you've got to compare it to some premium stuff. I also still kind of wonder how functional it is without an internet connection.

Like we were talking about Chromebooks being the online thing. Like what they do is you have Chrome and you do the things you do in Chrome. And if you don't have an internet connection, a Chromebook 's not very useful. Yeah. How useful will this be? Like to me, that's why it feels more like Android. Like I can have an offline photo and a photo editing app or tool and I can still do that offline and everything will work.

So that should be fine. I'm just curious like how much Gemini stuff. I think Rambler works offline. How much other stuff works offline? It works partially offline. Partially? Yeah. Will this connect to the internet and then your phone? Like you know how on the phone one of the features is you take a picture and it'll show up instantly in your files.

Will that work with no internet? Bluetooth or Wi-Fi? That's my question. But like directly to the device. That is my question for sure. Yeah. Yeah. I did not get an answer on that. I don't really know how that file sharing thing works or how the app sharing thing works. I'm hoping it's direct to the phone. That would be ideal. Yeah.

Yeah. We'll see. We'll see. So. Yeah. 10 years of updates. Quarterly updates similar to Android. Again. 10 years. 10 years coming from Google is the most worrisome thing I 've ever seen. AI is going to kill us within 10 years. But if you want to know more Jordan from 9to5Google had a very good video on it and covered and showed a lot of the stuff and also available October 4th.

So again teaser press especially because press was something where Rambler is the main one of the main features of AI in a room full of a billion people. I haven't seen a single example of Rambler working on it because it can't hear you. But. Oh well that's funny. October 4th funny date because the Pixel 1 was launched on October 4th of 2016.

Every year October 4th I'm like what what happens like what 's going on today. Today feels like an important day and I'm like oh it was just because when that event happened I had it like drilled into my brain. They made a big deal about October 4th 2016 because Hiroshi Lockheimer said in eight years you're not going to recognize Android.

So it's notable that they're releasing it on that day because like does that say something about what they think about this product or is it just random? Probably random. It's Google. Speaking of smartphone related things sometimes. Qualcomm has launched their new two nanometer chipsets.

Usually at SnapTruck and Summit they launch their flagship but this year they launched a flagship and an elite version of the flagship. So I feel like I can actually explain this even though the names are terrible. They're really bad. They're so bad. Right. Okay so there's a new Snapdragon 8 Elite Gen 6 and a Snapdragon 8 Elite Extreme Gen 6.

Yep. So every year around this time we start to get like the first phones with the new chip and so the new flagship chip as you can tell by the name is a Snapdragon 8 Elite Gen 6. Like we had the where is it? No Snapdragon 8 Elite Extreme Gen 6. Well okay this was I have the OnePlus 15 in my hands right now.

This had the Snapdragon 8 Elite Gen 5. Yeah. And that was the highest end chip from Qualcomm. And what you saw is you had like different manufacturers tuning it different ways based on their device. For Galaxy. Yeah so you had the 4 Galaxy one and Samsung phones. If you had like an ROG phone they would like overclock it a little bit and you'd get like the best highest clock speeds best possible one or whatever.

Yeah. So I'm pretty sure what's happening here is we have a new Snapdragon 8 Elite Gen 6 and then for the ones that want to get a little higher clock speed a little extra performance or whatever those extra few frames they have a slightly higher clocked version called the Snapdragon 8 Elite Extreme Gen 6.

It's a terrible name but all it is is a slightly higher performing version of the same chip. Well that's that makes me wonder will there be a Snapdragon 8 Elite Extreme Gen 6 for Galaxy? That's a good question. Yeah I do wonder about the 4 Galaxy thing because like whenever you hear 4 Galaxy they always explained it as like oh yeah a couple extra NPU things here a couple extra like features there whatever a little extra clock speed.

Yeah but that you know that chip wasn't anywhere else. Right. So you couldn't really compare it to anything else. Yeah. Yeah. TBD on that. So it has some new features. It can do 8K 60 FPS recording or 4K at 240. Marques is very happy. He wants more 8K.

Support for the APV codec and also a larger shared memory pool for the NPU and an AI dedicated matrix cores for GPU and more memory for better gaming performance. What does any of that mean? I think it'll be faster. Okay. So people are saying that the Extreme chip is a pretty minor upgrade over the regular one this year.

So it's going to be interesting who decides to use it because I'm sure that Qualcomm is going to charge quite a bit extra for those chips. One company who is using it though is Motorola who has pre- announced a new device called the Motorola Signature 27. Okay.

Have you seen this phone yet Marques? No. Please click the link. Wait I did see a screenshot of this. Okay. I don't really know anything else other than what I saw. This is a hilarious looking phone. It's a really weird looking phone. It has four cameras and an ambiguous black dot. We're not sure what it is yet.

There's a flash around. Yeah there's a flash around it. So not totally sure. They are being very ambiguous with the specs of this phone. They have announced a few of the specs but not all of them. It's supposed to launch by the end of the year. There's a it's got obviously the Snapdragon 8 Elite Extreme Gen 6.

Mm-hmm. Aluminum with a woven tactical back texture on the black and a brushed textile finish on the green version. Okay. They call the camera plateau they call it the camera plane. So it's not a mesa.

It's slow. It gradually goes up. It slopes up. Kind of like the dbrand cases how they've made it. Like it slopes on them now. It slopes up. So it's not it's the camera plane. It's not the mesa. It's not the plateau. There's four cameras the main the there's a periscope 200 megapixel telephoto and a 50 megapixel main camera which they were talking big about because it was some new Sony sensor that's supposed to be a really big deal.

Really quick with cameras. I'm confused because almost any time when you see a camera and like a rectangle cut out inside it that means periscope except this other camera in the top right. Well they could both be periscope. Dolby Vision 200 megapixel 100x super zoom. Yeah I don't know.

Who knows man. There's also a Bang & Olufsen logo like right in between all the cameras which looks really ugly. And I just wanted to note really quickly we've seen a lot of companies redesigning their logos recently. McLaren just redesigned their logo. There's been a lot of company redesigns. I think B&O might have to do it soon.

It kind of I don't know. I don't know man. This looks like one of those Bang logo redesigns. Is this this is their historical logo? This is their historical logo. I don't know if it just looks extra worse because it's on a 90 or a. They're ahead of their time man. This is terrible. Tilted. Yeah. So it's got Bang & Olufsen audio and I guess they had to slap that in between the cameras.

To point out that means nothing to me. Yeah. So I literally this might. No it's not going to get me. I. Be careful. I legitimately every every single company wants to tell you that they have Dolby surround support or whatever.

And I literally never write it down. I do not care. Yeah. Whenever you say oh speakers are by Bang & Olufsen or by or the by this extra. I do not care. Yeah. I just want to listen to them. They're all Samsung speakers. Well the Dolby thing just is like it supports their exact spec.

It kind of feels like a like DXOMark at this point. Yeah. Like doesn't. To hit a Dolby certification. Maybe Ellis you know this. Like you have to just do it the way Dolby says and then you get the certification. What does that mean in a phone? It just means. Crossfade. Nice surround stereo image.

I don't know. It's not that important. In a phone. How do I explain this? In a phone it is a lot more to do. It is less to do with hardware specs and more to do with DS P and codex stuff.

That's like the best way to put it. It's meaning that the internal processing that's calculating things like loudness is going to be put through the Dolby engine. It does not mean that you'll get that much. What it also means is if it's Dolby Atmos supported. If you're watching content that's encoded in Dolby Atmos which is different than a normal PCM audio stream.

The phone will be able to decode it directly to the amp that's driving the speaker. Whether that means you'll get a superior playback experience. That's my main point. That's who to say. But it does mean that if you're watching something on a streaming service that has Dolby Atmos.

You will at least know you're getting a Dolby Atmos stream to your thing. The Dolby Vision that is also on this phone. There is no Dolby Atmos on this phone? It's Dolby Vision. Dolby Vision is another one that means nothing to me. Dolby Vision is a specific HDR standard.

It's a specific HDR encoding schema that I think does frame by frame HDR. Like it's not doing any sort of... Wow. Almost exactly from my Google search. Word for word. Go Ellis. Damn. Ellis is AI overview.

No, I love standards and codecs. And I mean, I'll see a spec sheet on a device that says it has this max number of nits and this contrast ratio and it supports this HDR. And I'm like, that's also nice. Great. It will work with HDR and it will have...

It'll do the HDR effects with the high brightness and stuff . And I see Dolby Vision and I'm like, that basically is the same thing. I don't feel a special way about getting Dolby Vision. Yeah, but I mean, there's always like an open source version of the thing that these people are standardizing and stuff. It's not... I wouldn't say it is ProRes, but I think you can think of it in a similar way to ProRes in the sense of if you're shooting on a camera that supports ProRes and then you're editing in Final Cut on a Mac, you can get the full

experience and use out of that data protocol. Yeah. It's not a standard like ProRes is. It's not anything like that. But that's the way I would think about it is like if you're in that pipeline, it makes sense. And in theory, if for some reason you shot something on this that you would put in a Dolby theater, you could go end to end.

Yes. To be clear... You know what ruined it for me? Yeah. The MacBook Neo. I remember getting the demo from the MacBook Neo and listening to the speakers for the first time and they said, don't worry, these are Dolby Atmos speakers. And I hit play and I was like, these sound terrible. So whenever I hear Dolby Atmos, I just make sure to remind myself that doesn't mean they sound good.

It doesn't mean it. It just means it's certified. Can't anyone just say like, these sound good. Listen for yourselves. We need... Because it's like when you put Leica on the back of a camera, you're supposed to go, oh, that means it's good. When they put like this special name with the collaborative , like that, it's supposed to associate with quality. And I think that's what Dolby has become in many ways.

They go, oh, it's Dolby Atmos certified. It must have this big, booming, amazing sound. But it doesn't actually mean that. These branding things are really ambiguous because sometimes it means that they worked with them on the product to actually like optimize it and make it better. But sometimes it means they just slapped a logo on the back of something.

Atmos, at the very least, will never be a logo because in theory, if it has an Atmos logo on it, it means there's an Atmos engine running in the device. Like it doesn't mean that anyone did anything more than just like staple it in there. And then from the professional side of things, like working in Atmos is really, really nice.

Like when you're making a spatial audio thing, the work environment is nice. And it's also really nice to know that no matter what device this is getting played back on, it will be a reliable, accurate, similar thing spatially to what you heard in the studio. Because that to me is what Atmos is really good at.

It's good at saying like, hey, this sound is supposed to be over here. This device has X many speakers. I'm going to balance them like that to make that happen. Yeah. And I think that that's what, if people know that about Dol by and about what Dolby Atmos actually means, then when you see that it's Dolby Atmos certified, you will know what to look for.

I think for most people who don't know what Dolby Atmos means, it's designed to give you the impression of high quality speakers in general. And it doesn't always mean that. I probably shouldn't tell the story. I'm going to tell it anyway. One time I was at an Atmos event and a Dolby rep was like, hey man, love waveform.

I was like, thank you. He's like, did you know RSS feeds now support Atmos? So you can do waveform in Atmos. And I said, you know, I said, well, why, what's the point? Why would I do that? What would I get out of that? Yeah. And he went, I don't know. It's so you could have the logo that says it's a Dolby.

You could put it in the artwork of the podcast. Dolby Atmos. Yeah, we should. That'd be incredible. Well, to be clear, the Motorola Signature 27 does not have Dolby. I don't know. It has Bang & Olsen. Yeah. And I still don't know if that's good. Yeah, it did so much to me. Yeah.

They're being probably intentionally vague about the specs of this phone. They like released a few of them. I think the big thing is that they just wanted to announce that they were going to be the first ones with the Snapdragon 8 Elite Extreme Gen 6. I also get a really big kick out of that because every year , eight different phones come out and they say they're the first one.

And it's really funny to me. Wow. They also wrote this article on a Google book because it's all lowercase in the title. Interesting. But there is an uppercase T for the first letter. Yeah, Motorola's logo. They gave up at that point. Anyway, that was that. So we got a ton coming up.

I feel like we got to take a break because after the break, we're going to talk about a lot of Apple rumors that I may or may not have predicted. And a new OnePlus 16 that will make Marques cry and I will not indeed bury him with. But first, we got to do trivia.

That's my trivia. Oh, no, that's universally a call. You thought it was time out. And then you were like, wait, is that technical? No, it's trivia. It's trivia. Yeah. It's good. Guys, earlier, I really wanted to ask you a question about Exodia because you said- Obliterate!

You said five pieces of something. The answer would have been obliterate. Oh. So, nice. But instead, I'm going to ask you this question, which is earlier today, we talked about a two nanometer chip process. God, I also really wanted to be like, why are there x86 Google Books?

That doesn't make any sense. But we don't have time. There's so much to talk about today. Two nanometer chip process, two nanometers is about the width of a strand of what? Oh, I know. Answer at the end. It's a pop quiz if you guys watched the video about transistor size.

Two nanometers is around then. Yeah, but three nanometers was and that's pretty close. I don't know. That's 50% thicker, bro. I don't know. Yeah, well, Ellis said about. Yeah, but at that scale, everything's about. How about? No, it's not. Because my original question would be like, name me something that's two nanometers wide.

Not that much. Yeah. Anyway. All right. Yeah. We'll figure it out. Two one nanometer chips? That's true. Well, not chips, but things. Transistors. Transistors. Anyway. Okay. We will still crash out later. We'll be right back. Support for the show comes from Shopify.

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Go to granola.ai slash wave and try it on your next call. All right, welcome back. Real quick, David, I need to show you a video. Andrew, you've seen this already, I think? I'm pretty sure I saw it already. Okay, so this is the new Huawei Watch D3. Okay. And I'm not even going to show you the caption.

I'm just going to hit play. Yeah, I saw that. Okay, so it's a watch. Whoa. Wait a second. That was too quick. It inflates on the inside? Yes. I'm assuming it's a blood pressure cuff. Oh. Yes. Yes. So it inflates like a blood pressure cuff.

The Huawei Watch D3 has a built-in inflatable armband so that you can get maximum pressure on the sensor. It does get big enough for your arm? So that you can measure blood pressure. So you can use it on your arm? You don't have to only use it on your wrist. It looks like it's still on your wrist.

It doesn't look big enough for your arm. It's on your wrist. It's still on your wrist, but it's doing the inflating thing anyway to get your pulse. Yeah, yeah. It's an inflatable armband. Okay. It's like, I get it that we keep having all these watches trying to do health metrics that they clearly don't have the proper sensors to do.

Yeah. But I don't need to sacrifice. I don't need to take my blood pressure every five minutes. I don't need that all of the time. And now it just looks cumbersome. I will say that a lot of these health apps and health fitness wearables are requesting more and more of your health data that you would get from a doctor.

You know, like the new Apple Health app. In order to complete the pedals that it has, the little pedals that tell you about all your eyes, you have to import all of your blood tests, which a lot of people, I was like, I haven't done a blood test in forever. Then I realized I actually did, which was my first blood test in like 10 years.

But I was, I imported all that stuff and then I now have my pedal. But I think that a lot of these companies are trying to figure out not like ways that more people can access these types of metrics without going to a doctor. That's their whole thing. To get read of it. I guess doing it on your wrist is something.

A part of me just feels like this is one spec that they can say that they have that not everybody can say that they have. Yeah. Which feels a little silly. Like, oh yeah, we have, you have your heart rate, we have your blood oxygen, we have this, that, this, that, this, that. And. Yeah. You can do a blood pressure reading with maximum accuracy.

I wonder if your wrist is even a great place to take it. Cause usually they take it on your arm. And I feel like if they were going to do that, they should just announce, they should just release a puck that like attaches to the watch and then goes on your arm. So, because you're like, you said, you're not going to take blood tests or blood pressure tests every day.

Maybe you are. It's just like blood pressure tests. You're supposed to take in like pretty specific scenarios of like you're calm, your feet are flat on the floor. The cuff is near around the level with your heart. They're like, if you're just like on the subway rushing and you're like, oh, but it's it. The reading is going to be so different.

Yeah. At that point, is it even helping any? Oops. I popped my wristband. Great question. Yeah. I don't. Yeah. Very weird. That seems weird. I mean, I love Huawei loves to do crazy stuff, but. Also, is there a compressor in the, I have so many questions. Yeah. That means it has to have a compressor. Compressor. Yeah. Wow.

That's a great question. Well, thank you for showing me that video, Mark. Yeah. It's a good time. I appreciate it. All right. We're going to talk about the rumored Apple HomePad. Allegedly, we may be getting the HomePad finally next month . This year. Mark Gurman wrote this week that the AI driven Home Hub with the screen could be introduced as early as next month, which means October because it's September.

I love that term. As early as next month. As early as. I think. Yeah. I just wrote this down. Have we ever called anything leak speak? Because that's what I'm dubbing this right now. As soon as. As soon as. Like, it's just such a thing to be like, I wasn't wrong. It just makes it an open-ended window.

I'm pretty sure about this, but I don't want to be wrong as early as next month. Next month is a week and a half from now. Yeah. It makes it so you cannot be wrong. Pretty much. Smart. Yeah. Smart. I should start doing that when we bet on things. Yeah. Yeah. What if they announce it tomorrow? That would be so funny.

That's true. If it was September, he'd be wrong. Well, a couple of things he said about the product. It may be a mix of iOS, tvOS, and watchOS with a focus on using Siri AI. The display UI is probably similar to watchOS or standby mode. We're going to quote Gurman here. He says, the roughly square screen will come in versions that either.

Square? Yeah. Roughly square. Roughly square. Roughly square. Like a rough square. Roughly square. Like iPhone duo. Like a rectangle. This. I wrote this in quotes because I'm. Very confused by what he's trying to describe. Go on. Go on. Roughly square, aka rectangular, screen will come in versions that either sit on a stand resembling a HomePod mini chopped in half or attached to a wall.

I want everyone to picture that right now. No. I can't. I'm so confused. A HomePod mini chopped in half. Okay. Yeah. You've seen the renders of this, right? Half of the renders I see on things are just a HomePod and an iPad really poorly superimposed on top of the chip.

Do you remember the Pixel tablet? Yes. They discontinued recently. Mm-hmm. Do you remember the stand for the Pixel tablet? Yes. It was like a sphere that they like chopped it in half at an angle. It was more like a, I wouldn't call it a sphere, but yes. It was like a column. It was like a, right. It was like a.

Yeah. It was like a oval-ish rectangle that is like chopped in half. True. It's like the Nest home doubled in width chopped in half. Right. Kind of chopped in half. Yeah. So I, like when they say HomePod mini chopped in half, it's like the HomePod with like a, it's like a slice section. HomePod mini chopped in half.

Well, I don't know. The mini's the size of a tennis ball. Oh, the mini's tiny. So chop it in half and then a square screen on top of that. But imagine it's bigger. Yeah. Well, then they wouldn't say HomePod mini. Do you want me to show you a render? Yeah, but I. It sounds like a regular HomePod chopped in half. But he very specifically says HomePod mini chopped in half.

Does he? Yeah. I copy and pasted this. Yeah. I know what you're talking about with the HomePod and that 's also what I've seen. Yeah. But German said HomePod mini chopped in half. Yeah. Or attached to a wall. That's not a HomePod mini. Yeah, you're right. That's a HomePod. Yeah. Well, I guess that is. That looks like an old iMac.

Yeah, a little bit. That looks really cool, but I'm not sure if that's what's coming. That looks like somebody making a render. So remember, for audio listeners, the iMac that used to have a half circle on the bottom and this really cool metal rotating bendable arm that then had the screen on top.

Yeah. That would be awesome. Yeah. I don't think it's going to be that. It's not going to look like this. It would be so sick if it was Photoshopped. That's a terrible Photoshop. Yeah, this is just a HomePod mini, but with a little metal arm on top. The arm on top. And then like an iPad type thing. Yeah. This is an interesting form factor.

I mean, the idea makes sense, right? They have HomeKit and they have a bunch of accessories that plug into HomeKit. So you can buy a camera. You can buy a doorbell. You can buy these things that plug into Apple HomeKit. But any of these accessories that require any sort of visual, you can't use on Apple hardware.

I obviously have like the Google version of this, which is what is it? The Nest Home Hub is what it was called. Nest Home Hub. Which is the same idea. It's like an eight inch tablet on a speaker that just sits in the corner of your kitchen. And so when the doorbell rings, the video feed from the doorbell shows up on the screen. That's great.

Apple doesn't have an equivalent of this for their ecosystem. So they will now have essentially like an iPad that sits on a HomePod doing the exact same thing. Yeah. I think that smart home is Apple's next big frontier, right ? Because previously they just certified things to work with Apple Home. Yeah. And they had HomeKit and they have the Home app and they've updated the Home app a few times to add different things like automations, etc.

But now is their chance to actually start making a bunch of first party devices for the home. Because currently they're like seceding that market to Google and Amazon. And it feels like that's actually a big gap that could be really useful for Siri AI. Yes. Like if it works in a private way, and this is assuming it actually works, but there are a ton of features.

Have you used the new like Google Home app and all the AI features and stuff that it does? Like you can ask like, show me the footage of the raccoon pulling the trash out at midnight last night from the driveway camera. And it'll just pull it up because it recognizes things in the footage and all this stuff. It does an okay job.

Sometimes it just gets it wrong, but sometimes it gets it right. It does. Some things are kind of cool. Kind of cool. But then I think I literally had a bear go across and it was like squirrel. I forgot. It is funny when it gets it wrong, but I imagine there's a world where Apple would like to be able to have you like on your iPhone, just be like asking Siri, did the package get delivered?

And it'll just tell you because it knows because the feet of the doorbell goes to the HomeKit thing. And then you have the whole ecosystem. Yeah. So I could imagine a lot of Siri AI plugging into these accessories, things like cameras and doorbells and speakers and stuff.

And getting Apple products more around. Like remember when iMac got reintroduced for the M series. They're like, this is the computer you might put in your kitchen. Right. No, I want something like this in my kitchen. This makes way more sense. Yeah. The screen that can do maybe like a cooking video, maybe show the doorbell, maybe ask it some things.

Mark Gurman said like it might have facial recognition, which would then allow it to identify the person walking up to it to then feed different information based on who it is on the network. You know, the most interesting rumor I've seen about the hardware is that the display might be on like a robot arm that moves the whole display around, which I imagine being very different from what we've seen so far, which is just a fixed display.

And I'm not sure if they would do that because I always thought like the whole point of the center stage camera was the screen sits still and the ultra wide follows you around . But I have seen rumors of this possibly being on like a robot arm. That was quite a while ago. Those rumors were though. And like it was because they were developing that weird like Pixar lamp screen robot thing.

And I'm not sure like that just seems like a lot of moving parts. I agree. If I'm wrong, then I'm wrong. It's very possible. It seems very expensive if they did do something like that. And the only point would be like make sure I can see the screen no matter where in the kitchen I am. I don't really understand if that's worth it.

So either way, this is like a whole new category for them to get into. And it gives them the opportunity to release a lot of products. We went down a like rumor roundup a few months ago and one of them was a security camera. One of them was a home pad. One of them was the robot arm. So in the next couple of years, probably expect to see a lot of Apple home branded stuff.

Another thing you may be seeing in the next couple of years , which I was both right and wrong about, is a screenless fitness band, whoop competitor, Fitbit Air competitor that Apple is reportedly developing. Bring it. So according to Mark Gurman, they are working on this screenless fitness tracker that could rival Whoop and Fit bit Air.

A prototype of the band reportedly has a thin fabric with a sensor equipped to module similar to these products. Gurman says that the product is in the early stages of development and likely won't arrive until 2028, which is the point that made me kind of wrong. Well, and he also says it's a technology investigation, which means it has no track of development at this point.

It's just something they are investigating. But he also noted that Tim Cook is throwing his weight behind the product. So I feel like that's interesting. Yeah. The chairman? He doesn't weigh that much. That's cool. Well, sure. He's pretty fit. He doesn't say. Yeah, the chairman has no say. He makes almost as much as the CEO.

I'm sure he has a say. It's true. So you can clap for me if you want. But I am also partially potentially wrong because if the product comes out, Gurman says it will not come out until at least 2028. I give it a one year launch timeline, which was probably too ambitious.

Especially because I said the bet at two years and then you said one year. So two years would have been very close if the most optimistic view of this, then we would have at least had a good bet. I think I was just feeling ambitious with this because I figured it can't be that hard to make something like this when they already make the Apple Watch.

They should rush it to market because these are taking off right now. And within two years, maybe we'll have moved on to something else, smart glasses or something. Apple thinks on a 10-year timeline. I know. They're not waiting. That actually is the reason why I'm wondering if this does actually make it there because in two years, are these still going to be as popular when the market's been saturated so much?

I also got a lot of flack for this argument. I'm sorry. No, no, no, no. It's not your fault. I just think people didn't get my viewpoint was less of I don't think people want this. I do think a lot of people want this. I just Apple already has crazy market share on something that can record so much more of your information in an Apple Watch.

This feels like it would kneecap their own information. I feel like a band like this could record the same information but just not show it on the screen. Possibly except that we just developed this entire audio thing where they are recording all of your stuff all the time. But they could do that on a band too. It would just severely impact battery life probably.

And that's the whole point of these. Yeah, but there's no screen. It is weird though I say that because the Garmin screen this one actually has less battery life than almost all the Garmin screened ones. That's so weird. That's really strange. But you would have to add more components into it like a microphone and stuff.

Yeah, so we'll see. I don't know. I think Apple is very well positioned to do this because they already make really high quality bands. So they really just need to take their band team and just be like let's slightly redesign this. Ocean Band is this one. I'm pretty sure there's like a clip of me begging for this like six years ago somewhere.

Yeah, I actually asked the YouTube Gemini thing what is the earliest point where we talked about an Apple Screenless Fitness Band and it was in May. That's what it told me. That's if that's right. If that's correct. I've tried to use Gemini to reference YouTube videos, ours or other ones, and it usually turns down this whole thing of it getting it wrong until I say like it's okay if you're wrong.

And it goes, I can't actually watch any of these videos, so I don't really know why you're asking me. Yeah, I know what you're saying about Apple developing things on like 10-year timelines because that's what they do. They take their time with a lot of the stuff. I can't imagine why this would take so long to develop is my question.

Because they have the newly, let's just say that the Apple Watch Series 12, which just came out. You want to put all those sensors in it. You can put the same battery, the same taptic engine, the same everything. Just chop off the screen. Is that product good enough already to just be the new product? The battery life gets way longer because you have no screen .

And you have all the same sensors and all the same microphone, the same taptic engine to tap you on your wrist for your alarm, all that same stuff. And that's already a plenty good enough product. You take the screen out, the cost goes down. I don't see why that's not great. I think form factor needs to be different and then rearr anging everything.

It is a totally different product. The S11 chip is way overkill. You're doing a lot of display stuff. You don't have to have an S11 chip. You can do a way lesser chip in there. I feel like what else is there to develop? I'm not a developer of a product, so obviously. It felt like the redesign of the Apple Health app was actually designed to be an app that you view on your phone and your phone only.

Because it has all of these little elements and these pedals and these things that actually try to get you to open it a lot. And that's what the Fitbit app feels like right now, too. It's got all the information that's happening on your Fit bit. Normally, if that was just through Google, whatever it is that you Google Wear, Android Health.

Google Fitbit Health Gen 6 Extreme. I guess it's the same across the Google. What are the watches called now? Pixel Watch? Oh, the Pixel Watch. Yeah. But Android Wear. Android Wear is the OS on the Pixel Watch.

Is it still Wear OS? Oh, Wear OS. Wear OS. Is it still Wear OS? Yes. It's Google Book OS. As of right now. Okay. Could be different tomorrow. Well, they sort of optimized the new Google. They released the new Google Health app with the Fitbit Air . Yeah.

And they did that intentionally because they need to show you all of the Fitbit Air's information in like a big way that's optimized for your phone. Anyway, the Apple Health app redesign feels very optimized for your phone. So I felt like that was sort of a nod to that. But apparently, it's just a technology investigation right now.

So we'll see. I feel like if I was working at Apple, I'd be so frustrated at how long this time I am. Yeah. Look at all this stuff. It's blowing up. It's hot. Strike while the iron is hot. If I was them, I would have started doing this when the Who op got popular. Yeah. But especially now that the Fitbit and the Garmin and all these others are all dropping like it's hot.

Like this is the time. The Whoop getting popular is still like 0.5% of what Apple Watch does though. Yeah. So I don't think it's necessarily that they have a hard time spinning this up really quickly. They can probably do this in like a couple weeks. But it's more so is there enough market for them to bother doing this?

Yes. Yeah. There's lots of small markets. And this is like almost similar to the Google problem where sometimes it's just not worth getting into it because it's just a rounding error. Like how many are we going to sell? It's not even a billion users. We might as well not do it. But I do feel like this is just right underneath their nose .

And it's a fast growing market which is a point I made an Apple Watch video this past week which is it doubled in the past year and it's been rapidly gaining a lot of popularity and chatter. So yeah it feels like it's right there. I wouldn't be surprised if this new health app is what they use to gauge it on because all of the information you get now is the Whoop killer in the sense of metrics which so many people like Whoop for because of fitness age and recovery and all that stuff.

So now they have that now they can see how much of this is just going to make people happy with their Apple Watch or are people still going to Whoop. Whoop already is in this weird spot where they're like trying to do all these things by giving it to you for free on an Amex and stuff like that. They seem like they're struggling to keep growing whereas again a Whoop market share to Apple might be a rounding error.

For sure. For sure. I want to know really quickly this is a slight tangent but I just like this readiness score thing. like I hate these things. Dr. Mike. I really. One to ten. Because you know what the Fitbit Air does? It's like if I didn't sleep perfectly or if I went to bed one hour late I wake up in the morning and it's like oh your readiness is at 64.

You probably shouldn't do anything today. Which is crazy. I don't remember the last time it told me to work out. Every day it's like you should probably take it easy today. It only tells me to work out if I slept absolutely perfectly. You're ready to push it today. You're ready.

There's two levels like chill chill chill or you slob. It's like yeah. Wake up. Don't go to the gym and be lazy if you're anything but absolutely perfect. You should be able to tune it. It's crazy. To like how drill sergeant do you want it to be? You should be able to decide. Yeah.

Because you know if you're getting one of these assistants you're probably on the closer to a beginner side where I'm going to listen to the assistant and it tells me what to do . And if it's always telling me wow you're not doing enough I 'd feel bad. Yeah. And that's a good side to miss on. Yeah. So people they're missing on the side of like you're doing great.

It's fine. Everything's good. Yeah. But it's not. So what's ironic is if I had like a bad day the day before because I like had an extra glass of wine and I feel crappy in the morning that's when I'm more inclined to go to the gym to make myself feel better. Because I knew that I messed up the day before so I want to rectify it like I'm eating my vegetables to counteract all of the steak that I ate or something.

Even I don't like steak. Yeah. Now you know. I feel like that's the like whoop is supposed to be the like top 1% athletic like all you do is focus on working out diet recovery. Boom boom boom boom boom I'm ready for my next event.

But now it's like also tech CEO who kind of cares about his fitness is also like putting himself to the same standards as that while drinking a glass of wine at dinner. Yeah. And like we're putting it into our everyday life which probably doesn't really matter.

We will get. Hey yeah. LeBron James famous 76er does have a glass of wine with dinner every day. Every day. I don't know if he still does it but there was like a 10 year period where he was like he swore by his glass of wine . That's so funny. Wow. You should be able to yeah you should be able to tune your AI coach to be a little more gung ho if you want it to be.

Just open to like not being perfect all the time. Yeah. You can just not wear it. Listen to your body. Yeah. You can just be like damn I want to go to the gym. Oh. There's a lot of people out there who have never gone to the gym and they need like the beginner. That's true.

I still am all for that if it's a motivation thing. Yeah. For sure. There's two kinds of tech companies like we're experiencing this sort of K-shaped reality where like there are some tech companies like Garmin and Apple that I would assume out of fear of liability can't tell someone to work out unless they can be almost 100% sure their body is like not going to hurt themselves because they end up being liable.

And then on the other end of the K-shaped you have companies that are like my product committed more felonies than your product this week. Yeah. I feel like it's unreasonable to not be able to tell someone like go crush it at the gym and then they don't do perfectly. I think that's fine. Yeah.

You know. I had a 7 readiness score out of 10 and it's told me to skip the gym. A 7. 7's pretty good. 7's pretty good. It's passing. I got through high school on 7. Yeah. That's what I was saying. Anyway. That's just a tangent but I hope that Apple tells me to go to the gym even if I have a 1.

All right. Well. Let's talk about something else that will get Marquez really sad. That also has a 1 in it. All right. Break it down. Cooking. 1 plus 16. 1 plus 16. We see it. I think. All of these are rumors but we're just taking it as fact at this point.

We're deep into the pod where we can just say this is all true. And just to be real. Just to be clear. The only thing I'm mad about is that this phone is not coming to the US. Wow. Spoiler alert. Because it looks pretty good man. Okay. So. Pretty good. Looks pretty amazing. It looks just like the 1 plus 15 except we have three different colors which I'm going to explain them all because all three of them are quite a bit different.

We have Dark Forest which is black. Looks black to me. We have Mars Masterpiece which is orange. Which is beautiful. And has like a subtle topographic. Kind of like your hat. Map. My hat is pink. It's coral. It's salmon. It's like coral salmon. Just like the phone coral salmon. Then we have Tomorrow's Starlight which is silver with the same topographic design but also text that says 16 area coordinates and an X in the top corner which might glow.

It does. I think it glows. It does. Yeah. There's a hands-on video of it glowing. There is a hands-on video of it glowing. Okay. Only when five contacts call you though. They have to be your favorites. Why is it called Tomorrow's Starlight? They ran out of other words.

We're running out of color names. You can't just call it Starlight. That's taken. That's true. That's taken. Specs. Specs seem to be 165 hertz default refresh rate that can climb to 185 hertz in specific games. 9,000 million power battery.

100 watt wire charging. 50 watt wireless charging. Snapdragon 8 Elite Gen 6 Pro chip. So this is a... 2 nanometers. Wait. Pro. That's what it said. Pro? Pro chip. Maybe because they didn't know about the release of the Extreme chip yet.

They were calling it Pro. Oh yeah. Because this was two days ago. Yeah. So maybe it is the Elite chipset. It could be the Elite. Yeah. Again, take it for a word if we're right. We're just speculating if it's wrong. Yeah. LPDDR6 RAM. Oh my God.

Wait. Which one of you is doing that? I don't know. Keep going. Keep going. 16 gigs of RAM. 16 gigs of RAM. A Terracid card only comes out for OnePlus phones. This one is so good. 200 megapixel 1 over 1 4th inch sensor. Wow.

50 megapixel ultrawide telephoto. Wow. And an AI dedicated button on the side. Yeah. Can I custom map that button to other things? Only for five contacts. Also a 165 hertz panel. Yeah.

Well, 165 hertz, but up to 185 hertz. Yeah. Currently they're at 120 up to 144. So it is priced at 5,000 Chinese won, which if converted, which is always weird conversion rates, 746 USD. Unbelievable.

That is a price bump over last year's 15. Unbelievable. This is insanely good. As far as on paper, OnePlus has been doing it for a long time. Yeah. On paper, they've been doing it a long time. This is like OnePlus was like, we're breaking up with you, US, and we're going to get really hot after too.

Yeah. Because they used to, they were, it's almost like they went through a phase. Like they award, they did this with the OnePlus One, right? They showed up. They were like, fastest this, most that. Here's your storage. Here's everything. Great. And it's the cheapest price. And I went, that's good. That's nice.

And then the first few phones were the enthusiast phones, right? And then we had this little dip where for like four or five years, like OnePlus 8 through OnePlus like 13 or whatever, they had a, they were too expensive. The prices went up too much. They were kind of doing the mainstream thing.

They were missing features. They blend ColorOS and Oppo's like software. The whole thing was a little murky and it didn't really have an identity. Yeah. And now they're bringing it back. They're back in the gym. They're doing great phones. And the OnePlus. Nobody can say that we don't have enough testosterone on this podcast.

We're grunting like hell. The OnePlus 15, I've been carrying this phone, yeah, mostly for the last year, basically now since it came out. And it's like, it's a great phone. It's quick. Software features are there. It's, I mean, the cameras aren't that good. And you know, these, these new cameras might not be that good either, but the battery life has been amazing.

Like it's a super quick phone. And now here we go. We're just going to double down on all that stuff. 9,000 milliamp hour battery. Yeah, that's crazy. That's, that's crazy. That's my car. Faster chip, faster. I said faster chip already, but faster Snapdragon chip and faster LPDDR6 RAM and faster display and faster charging and 9,000 milliamp hour battery.

This is, this is the, on paper. Yep. This is the stuff of dreams. It's a, it's a, it's a better phone. Unfortunately, it's not coming to the US. And for that reason, I don't know that I'll ever even hold one. It's also has lights on the back. We'll get you one. We could get you one. It's only coming to China. In silver.

Yeah. Which is even worse. I think we could figure out how to get this. Yeah. The silver one has lights on the back. I, maybe we'll just try to get one. Do you think it has global bands? No, there's no way. I want to get one and like try to put my eSIM in it. And it's just going to be, it's going to be so depressing when it doesn't work. Yeah. Tomorrow's starlight. For some reason. Yeah.

It is cool looking. What is the X logo on the top? It, I think it looks like something or is it just a design? I think it's just an accent. I kind of wish the OnePlus logo lit up. It says 16 area. I don't know what that is. Also, it's a Chinese only phone and it has something written in English on the back, which is kind of confusing.

Yeah. I don't know. Well, anyway, after the break, we've got possibly the worst decision ever made in history. Jeez. Like eight of them back to back. From YouTube. From YouTube.

So if you're into that deep dive, nitty gritty YouTube creator content stuff. It's coming. It's coming. We did the OnePlus thing just to amp Marquez up to just go off on the YouTube thing. So don't, don't go away. So we built the biggest Jenga tower just so we could knock it over.

But of course, before the trivia, before the, but of course , I couldn't resist. You know what I meant to say. You know what I meant. We're recording this episode later in the afternoon. It's not our normal morning time. All right. So. A little weird.

What does APV stand for? From APV Codec. Oh. Damn. I literally almost wrote it out. I know. Instead of just putting the, yeah. Okay. Do we talk about that? Where does that come from? It's from the Snapdragon chip. Oh, that's why. It has the, it has APV Codec support.

Yeah. I think I could, I could guess. You'll probably be right. That's what you do in trivia. Well, I'm down by like eight points right now. I need solid answers. There's a subreddit post that just said like, he has 11 and it's like all of our faces. That was my burner.

That was my burner. Our faces are so funny in that screenshot. Yeah. Yeah. We'll find out. I'm going to do my absolute best to rack my brain to think about that by the end. We'll be right back. Bye. Support for the show comes from Square, the business platform that helps sellers become neighborhood favorites.

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All right, welcome back to our third and final segment. We got to talk about YouTube news. So we have brought in Mariah, who has replaced Adam, for our final segment. For those who haven't been here for long enough, Mariah is an editor here.

And so we have lots of thoughts on YouTube and videos and editing that will make way more sense. We'll get there. But maybe we'll start with going through what was announced at YouTube's Made on YouTube event. Yeah, and by the way, I've seen none of this, so I'm hearing it for the first time. Perfect. I watched a, like, six-minute video that speed ran everything.

Feel free to ask. So I understand none of it. I just typed it down. I've got all the info. I was briefed on it. And then I went to a presentation. I talked to a bunch of YouTube employees. I talked to a bunch of YouTubers. Every year they have this Made on YouTube event, so we've had some time to digest it. And I'll go through all this stuff with you. So why are you so optimistic about this year's Made on YouTube?

I would say I am not in the optimism camp. Oh. Oh, no. But that's okay. Really? Some of it is good stuff. Some of it is different. Different. Okay. Okay. So here's what's first. Custom feeds. More scared. So, you know. Oh, like Blue Sky. So you know most people, most people when they go to YouTube just go to the homepage, right?

Remember how subscriptions died many years ago? Yeah. Your homepage is trying to do its best to understand all the things you watch and serve you useful stuff. But sometimes you just want to go back to that time that you were obsessed with trains, and you just want it to be all the train stuff again. Well, now you can just ask in natural language this AI custom feeds feature to build a feed for you just on the trains.

And there it is. You've got your homepage. You've got your trains page. You've got your feeds page. It seems like it was on the top almost like. Exactly. Yeah. And you can have different ones up there. You can have a bunch. I think that's cool. Train page. My disc golf page. Seems cool. My train page. My photography page. My David Amell page.

Yeah. All the good stuff. Sometimes I'm in the mood for the car videos. Sometimes I'm in the mood for the podcasts. Sometimes I'm in the mood for the music. And so I just have a feed that's just that stuff. And it's a variety of it. Can you make a subscriptions feed? Yeah. It hasn't gone away.

It's the only thing I'm subscribed to. Wait a second. It's not gone. We're definitely going to hit that ramp of like subscriptions. Yeah. And then subscriptions. We can reference analytics a few times in this. I think, you know, back in the day when I published a video , the first day's worth of views were all people who were subscribed in their sub boxes.

Nowadays, it's all of the same people, but they don't go to their sub boxes. They just go to the homepage. Just gets fed. And because they're subscribed and it's a new video and they usually watch when it's new, YouTube puts it there. Yeah. So the homepage drives traffic and this is just some custom homepages. Okay. Cool.

I like that. All right. Yeah. Next is a short series. So there's obviously lots of short form creators. And I think us, we think of short form as like the funnel for the long form. But there are lots of people who just do short form. And they get really invested into this really intense short form stuff.

So just like you can make a long form series and play through those videos one by one, you can now make a short series with a cover page. And they play in order. And there's episode one, two, three, four, five. Yeah. The whole thing. Also notably, shorts dramas have been popping off recently where you have like 70 episodes of like a little thing that 's just a continuation of the last episode.

So people want to watch more and more of these. And a lot of money is being pumped into this. Even in like Hollywood where they're investing in these shorts drama series. So I think being able to give you a series page is very helpful. So you can actually watch the entire series instead of randomly seeing it in your sub box or whatever.

Feels good. Yeah. Yeah. You can now see posts on TV. You can now see. You can now use GIFs. GIFs. GIFs. GIFs. GIFs. You can now use GIFs in YouTube comments. GIFs. I forget what I like. You can also. I agree with you, the audience.

Whatever you right now are saying out loud. You can have to sit. You got to pick one. You can now answer comments on the TV. You know, there's a bunch of new features like that. On the TV? Do text-to-speech. Yeah. Do text-to-speech. Oh, my God. Text-to-speech. Yeah. You just talk to your TV and it'll put that comment down. Imagine Claire walking into the living room and being like, you f***ing idiot.

Like, no, it's actually. Talk. I can't believe you. Yeah, actually, that's a great. You know what they should do? In order to leave a comment, you have to leave it with your voice. It has to say it out loud. You have to say it out loud. As your voice. Because as soon as these people say these things out loud, they're going to feel horrible. Yeah. And not actually leave these comments.

Okay, let's keep going. You know how there's messaging? There's not going to be group messaging. No. That you can, like, send videos in also? Yeah, like a group chat. We actually may be cool. Why don't we bring back the inbox? Why are we scared of the inbox? It seems like they're slowly kind of doing that. Bring it back. Basically. Like, they used to just have an inbox. So, it's just kind of the same thing.

Group messaging is good as long as it's not the way that it is now where I, like, tweet a link to a YouTube video and then I get 90 message requests from random people. I think that part is, they got to fix that. Yeah, they got to fix that. Yeah. Did they even test it? I don't need another app that has group messaging in it.

Sorry, YouTube. Hey, our Instagram studio group chat is pretty fire. Look, if YouTube's going to be social media, they've had the media, but they got to bring back the social. Google Plus, baby. Yeah. All right. I was just thinking about how much I miss Google Plus. Anyway. Where are you? Auto-dubbing for live.

So, you know, you can have auto-real-time dubbing into different languages. So, for example, you speak English, but you have Spanish viewers. In the live, it'll dub in Spanish and they can watch it in their native language. It's almost like a live translation. Yeah. It's great. It seems like it was only in Spanish from the video.

I think that's what they're starting with, but they're going to do more, which is cool. You didn't mention fandom. Fandom. So, you can... Okay. Is this where we start? This is a good one. Look, I'm not a streamer. Yeah. This is... I'm not a live streamer, but you can live stream.

First of all, you can do a co-live stream next to another streamer. So, you're both streaming at the same time and your audiences see you both at the same time. It's like a collab, but live. Or showdown. Sorry. That's what that's called. And then like a showdown is like the two of you both enable super chats at the same time. And then it's like a counter above you for whoever's audience donates more wins.

Wait. There's like a showdown of your audience. This has been a thing on TikTok before where you like roll through a bunch of other people on like vertical live and then you both come in and all the audience of both of them come in and donate to the person they want.

And there's like literally... It's like a tech area. The UI is literally a counter at the top of who's audience donating money. It's of who's making the most money. Yeah. What stage of capitalist hell is this? We're on another level. Oh my God. It's awful. If it was like likes, I would get it, but like money is crazy.

Another one that got a funny reaction because it was along the same lines is you remember hypes? Vaguely. Channels under half a million subs can get hyped. 500,000. What do you mean remember hype? Like they took that away already? No, it's still there. Sorry. We crossed half a million. We thought we would stop having hypes, but I think we can still have hypes.

It finally went away. It finally went away. Yeah. You can only hype a certain number of videos per day, but now you can pay to hype even more with jewels. Can I read a direct quote from the video? Jewels. Jewels. This will clear things up. I promise you.

Okay. Purchase jewels to supercharge your videos leaderboard momentum. This gives you a new revenue stream by earning rubies. So I can only earn Indian money? The guy in the video said that with a totally straight face and it was like, next. You said rubies with a B, right? Rubies.

Rubies. Oh, okay. Rubies. Oh, yeah. No, no. Yeah. Got it. So instead of only a few hypes, you can just buy jewels and then that's worth more than a regular hype. What's a ruby though? What can I buy with that at a grocery store? Can I pay my rent with jewels? The creator does get a share of what was paid to give you those hypes.

A share? Yeah. Yeah. I don't know the percentage, but it is some percentage. This is Twitch figured this out with like bits and everything is Twitch got mad that people on Twitch were getting donations through like PayPal and they weren't getting a cut of it. So now every video platform is trying to be like, no, no, this is the easier way to pay your favorite creators.

We just want a little slice of that. Oh my gosh. So here's your route. So you're not getting $5. You're getting 700 rubies. Which is equivalent to what? Probably like tree 50 and I get a dollar 50. No, but it's going to be like Xbox Live points where at any given moment, I'm sure how much a ruby is could change.

Who knows? The marketplace? It's not a marketplace, but that's why all of these companies do this. V-Bucks. Yeah. V-Bucks. Airline Miles. RuneScape GP. Yeah. A lot of this very much seems like them just copying other features on other platforms so far. All right. Jesus.

But I think the big ones, there's like three big ones that I want to talk about. All right. I'm blind to this. Let's go. Okay. So the first one is dynamic thumbnails. What? So YouTube, as of right now, we've already talked about the ability to A-B test thumbnails, right?

Yes. You're unsure which thumbnail is better. So you run an A-B test. It serves half to one audience, half to the other. And then you realize one of them is more effective and you go with that one. Dynamic thumbnails are you can upload multiple thumbnails for the same video and YouTube will dynamically pick which thumbnail gets served to which audience depending on their behaviors and which one it thinks will work best with them.

Oh. It's interesting because there's a good version of this that I can imagine, which is like we have text in our last thumbnail. It says always listening in English. But if you're watching from a Spanish-speaking country and you're going to watch the Spanish dub, maybe it makes sense if there's a version with Spanish text in the thumbnail as well.

Can we do that already? We kind of are doing it like band-aided together on the back end. But this is now supported by YouTube where you can upload the different versions and it will dynamically do this for you. Okay. So that's the way that I think it makes sense. Maybe if someone's colorblind, that color won't be in the thumbnail or like...

I know. Well, it's you're uploading them. So it's not YouTube making them, although I think that's just like one AI step away. But you're uploading the different thumbnails and it's deciding based on user behavior which one it thinks will work better. Okay. It's like selecting a demographic and which one's going to ...

The thing for this is if you wanted to really, in our tech world, the easiest way to do this would be this video potentially would work really well with people who hate Apple or really well with people who hate Android. And then you can just change that one piece of text on the thumbnail.

Sure. And maybe it would send to those. That just sucks. Because that means the video itself has to be very neutral or going to both of those. So all you're prioritizing is the click on that. This is just... Yeah. This is going to really be a pain in the neck in our space.

I think there's going to be some weird thumbnails that are trying to get both sides. And then you're going to get to a video that's just not that interesting. And if you're optimizing for clickability and YouTube is specifically deciding who it's optimizing each thumbnail for, then you're kind of just...

YouTube could be optimizing for rage gaugement. Yeah. Which is also not great. What isn't optimizing for rage? How does it decide and do you influence that? That part is unclear. So there are a lot of unanswered questions with a lot of these features. That one, I think it was just YouTube dynamically using AI to figure it out.

And I don't have much more info on that, unfortunately. Okay. The last two features, in my opinion, the more I've thought about them, both potentially catastrophic. Oh, no. Oh. So I'll let you decide which one we talk about first. Okay. Video A-B testing or...

Wait. Ask YouTube. Let's go with Ask YouTube. Yeah. I want to know why that one's catastrophic. Because the other one sounds like the end of the world. So let's talk about... Okay. Let's talk about this one first. I'll explain what it is and then we can talk about why it might be insane. Okay. So the feature itself is you can imagine if you're on a YouTube video and you're wondering if at some point in the video the creator is going to talk about a certain thing.

Let's say you're on a camera review and you want to know how good the battery life of the camera is. There's a little Ask YouTube button at the top. You can click it and you can ask this AI chat bot, hey, what does the creator say the battery life is of this camera? And it will go ahead and find the part of the video where that gets talked about.

Okay. It'll hyperlink you to the exact timestamp of it. Yeah. You can watch that section and then peace out. Cool. So... Gemini kind of does that already. Yeah. But this is now built into the YouTube UI and it's up and it actually lives in the search box all the time. As they already have that built into the Gemini built into the YouTube UI.

This feels like the more upgraded version because I thought there was an Ask about this video previously. With Gemini. Yeah. So this is available, I feel like, in a similar capacity when you Google search. If you are Google searching a how-to this, it already serves you that where it'll pull a YouTube video and pull you to the timestamp.

So it's just feeling like more accessible but on the platform itself. There's an Ask with Gemini feature that's asked about this video and you can ask like, when do they talk about this? And it brings you to the timestamp. If you scroll down. Yeah. You can ask questions. Yeah. I don't think this is inherently bad.

It surfaces that like much more towards the top. Okay. And my question where I think this is potentially interesting is I always wonder how this stuff influences both the content that we make and the user behavior around the content that we make. Yeah.

And so the example that they gave was actually like right at home, which is it was a product review. And instead of starting at the beginning and watching the entire video, they kind of just like searched for like three different answers. I think the example in my – the presentation they gave us was like they asked which camera – it started actually before watching any videos.

It started with them asking YouTube which camera should I get that has like retro vibes and like has like a fun nostalgia feel. And then it gave us a bunch of suggestions and some videos to watch. And then they continued to talk to the chat bot and ask things like, all right, well, which one do reviewers say has the best battery life and a flash that makes me look good?

And then it would sort of narrow it down and find videos that say those things. And then it would say – it would suggest one of the videos. And then inside the video it would allow you to continue to ask things like, well, what do the comments say about battery life? And I find that strange. Why would you ask what the comments say about battery life?

Why wouldn't you ask what the video says about battery life ? But aside from that, I think all of these things shortened the amount of time you spend actually watching the video. Yeah. And that was the thing that I worried about with that. It kind of sounds like it's data mining all of YouTube as a Google search engine.

Yeah. It's like a similar experience to that. Yeah. So if you – and I always think about our videos as like two buckets of people that watch them. There's the subscribers and the people who are watching the whole video for entertainment value, et cetera, education value.

They aren't necessarily going to buy the thing. But then the long tail also of people who are in a purchase decision and are watching a bunch of videos about products to decide which one to buy. Those two viewers behave very differently. And I wonder if that second batch of viewers behaves even more differently when they don't have to watch the video.

They just ask for the thing and then they peace out. Yeah. I wonder. I mean, one, they should let creators opt out of that on their videos. They never will, but they should. My optimistic sense of this versus the like just ask Gemini because in the Gemini thing you can ask without even starting the video.

Yeah. If it at least brings you to a point in the video that watches enough of it that runs to us as we at least get paid for it, it makes it not quite as bad as the just like scrape it, never get the view, never get the benefit of it. Because at least it doesn't go into the full like dead internet theory of pulling from the thing that makes the person money.

Therefore, they can never create the actual reviews part of it. But it does really suck to assume an AI is going to grab something in a video correctly with the correct context around it. Because just because we might say like X phone's battery life is good, if that's where it pulls out, it doesn't pull it out because we might think the battery is good because the charging is really good for it.

Or that we like the efficiency of whatever. Like there's all these different levels to that that if you just hit a little 10 second clip in the video doesn't actually help the consumer at all. Yeah. I think the context bit is important a lot of times especially. And I keep using the example they used of like I'm watching a product review.

I just want to know if the battery life is good or not. Or I just want to know if the camera is good or not. Will they say that in the video? It will say that in the video, but we'll say it with the context of like for a foldable or for a thin and light or something like that. We'll have, we'll review it and we'll talk about all these other things in the video with some context for what it is and its competitors and its price and all this other stuff.

So when someone asks like if they ask the feature is the iPhone Duo's camera good, you might get to like a section of the video where I go. So yeah, I think it's a pretty good camera. But you'll probably miss the part where I go all foldables have worse cameras than slab phones because they're thinner .

But like you're stripping the context because you just got to the part where you got the answer to the AI question. So I'm just, I just wonder how that, how that affects the viewer experience and like when I'm making the video now, do I have to think about how people are going to skip around?

They already skip around, but like how are they going to skip around with this feature? This is sort of a theme in most media in 2026 is that we just strip out all the context and just take out little bits and removing context changes what you're consuming and changes like everything around it.

So that doesn't, doesn't seem great. Yeah. Doesn't seem great. Okay. Tell me. All right, Marquez, I'm ready. Okay. Just stick the needle in. Okay. So you know how you could A, B test video titles? Yeah. You could actually A, B, C test. Yeah. And you could A, B test video thumbnails. Yeah. Already kind of, you know, teetering on like what I see is not quite what you see, you know, but it's, you know, that 's okay.

Yeah. Sure. So starting early next year, you'll be able to A, B test the video itself. Yeah. What? So the video itself. So you could watch a video. Okay. But the person who also clicked the same title and thumbnail could get a different version of that video.

Now, hear me out. Hear me out. Because they did give a use case for every single one of these. So here's the example they gave. I'm an example. You're a creator. You know, you're, you're editing your video. It's a 10 minute long video. And you're thinking about that retention curve. And, you know, this, this little cold open you did, you're not really sure if it's a good idea or not.

You've got one version with a montage in the intro and one version with a cold open where you just cut right to the chase. And you're not really sure which one is going to give you the best retention. So you just export both versions of the video and then A, B test them. And YouTube will actually give you the watch percentage and a nice little side by side graph of the retention for both versions of that video.

Okay. Now, that's the best case scenario, I think. And that still has a bunch of unanswered questions. Yeah. But there are lots of ways that I have thought about that I don't like the way this could go. And I'm sure you guys are all thinking of the same things now.

Can I, is there any restriction to what this is? Do the videos have to be the same length? Do they have to have a certain amount that's the same? Another great question. Do you think these are two totally separate videos? No and no. So far, no restrictions on how different the videos have to be or how different the lengths of the videos have to be.

Not that I've seen. There's also no answer to, let's see, how different the videos, yeah, in general, how different are the videos. Also, there's comments. Yeah. Which version of the video did they watch when they left that comment?

They share the same comment pool? They share the same comment section. Oh, God. Matter of fact, timestamped comments are very popular. Yeah, wait. What if there's something in version one that's not in version two and they left a comment and nobody can tell what they're talking about because they watched the wrong version of the video?

Oh, God. You know what I mean? Like there's a lot of unanswered questions. And here's the thing that I was most thinking about. This is, I'll stop talking after this. When we A-B test thumbnails, which we do occasionally, it's usually because we're lacking some conviction, right? We're not really sure which version of the thumbnail we want to run.

And so we'll run it and we'll find that if there's a small difference between the two thumbnails, it won't really produce any meaningfully different click-through rate or watch time share. Yeah. But if there's a big difference in like the concept or the total framing or something like that, then we'll learn something.

Yeah. And I fear that that's probably also what's going to happen with videos, which is if it's only a small difference, only a few cuts, only a few differences here and there between the two videos, we probably won't learn very much. The retention curves probably won't be that different.

And so it will encourage more drastic differences between the videos that you're testing and probably in the name of hyper-optimization and just which one gets the best retention curve. This is what I was thinking a lot.

There's two main points here that I'm thinking about. One, that point where it's like we are just barreling towards what is the optimal dopamine machine. Like every video needs to have the most possible retention, so you need to say these exact things and make these exact cuts and do this, and you need to just test, test, test, test, test until you whittle down to the center of the human brain.

That's the first major problem I see here. Second major problem, we are just barreling towards this reality where my reality is not your reality. Yeah. And the fact that multiple different people could be referencing the same video and go, when he said this in the video, and you go, what are you talking about?

That is bad. That's just bad. Like, and the fact that their account has one version of the video and your account has another version of the video , that we shouldn't be making it more complicated to know what the truth is. We're already doing that constantly with, like, Google Phot os editing and Gemini editing and generative AI, but, like, the fact that now there are just, like, multiple sources of truth, and none of them are technically wrong, but it's just your algorithmic truth versus my algorithmic truth, that's bad.

It's Schrodinger's video, bro. It's both alive and dead until someone watches it. But even when they watch it, it could be a different one. David, what if we get three apology videos, and then whichever apology video is optimized for your... You get the ukulele.

Yeah, the electric guitar. We could, every phone that releases, we could make the this phone rules and this phone sucks video and put it in the same link and just make everyone happy. So what you're describing is, like, the... Immediately when YouTube comes out with a new feature, you have to think about, like, how are people going to abuse this?

Yeah. Yeah, and that's the nice way of abusing it. Think of all the other people on YouTube and how they're going to absolutely abuse the ever-loving shit out of this. If I was the CEO of YouTube, I would not have greenlit this feature. And I do think the line is somewhere in between A-B testing videos and A-B testing thumbnails and titles.

Thumbnails and titles, at first, were also kind of crazy to us, but it's the packaging of the video. And there is, to some extent, like, okay, I think that certain versions of this may appeal to different audiences and they may watch it, but I'm not really sure. I can understand why you might want to test between different thumbnails.

Like I said, we do that occasionally. Yeah. Sometimes it's in the name of optimization because once you run the test, they tell you which one performed better as far as retention and watch time. So it seems like that's what we're optimizing for. But sometimes it's just like, yeah, did it feel like that worked or not?

I also don't want to encourage creators to start making content based on algorithmic decisions. It's too late. Instead of who they are. So many times the YouTube team has, like, people ask them about the algorithm and their thing is always just like, you don't have to worry about the algorithm.

Don't worry about any of that stuff. Just make good content for your audience. And this is the exact opposite of that. This is just make a bunch of content that can make anybody happy. No one knows what you're actually watching anymore. I, this is nuts.

This is the dumbest thing I've ever seen. There has to be some guardrails. There's like no way. Yeah. Like I said, if it's just innocently testing two different intros, the same seven minute video, I get it. Even if the comment section is confusing with the timest amps, even if like, I get that's maybe the best case scenario. But when there are two drastically different versions of a video, how do you, there's no way that's not bad.

I imagine they're going to split the comment sections into like, you'll have a comment section for the version you watched and someone else will have a comment section. I don't think they're going to do that. Then the comments would split in half though. So the reason I don't think they're going to do that, and this is, I usually just predict the future based on what's happened in the past. I'm going by how they've run A-B testing titles and thumbnails.

Yeah. When you're watching a video, you do not know if the title or if the thumbnail was a part of an A-B test. Only the creator knows that. And that would still be true about the video. The video is different. I agree. But that's how they've run it so far. So you watch the video and sometimes you'll even realize it .

You'll click on a video and you'll watch it and remember the title and thumbnail. And then two days or a day later, you'll see it embedded on a website or something or on your feed again. And it has a different title or thumbnail. And that's when you'll realize either it was changed or it 's part of a test and you're getting the other half of that test. Yeah. But yeah, you won't know.

And then the other one is you once you watch the video, like someone else could have arrived on the same video from a different title and thumbnail. Someone else can be watching the same video at the same time, but it's the other version of the video and you won't know. So you'll leave comments and they'll also leave comments and you won't know that the comments you're engaging with were talking about the other version of the video.

And if they're drastically enough versions of the video, the comments won't make sense anymore. Yeah. They'll be talking about different things. So, yeah. And as far as like abusing it, yeah, there's going to be creators who are like, oh, I'm just going to upload like three different, totally different versions of the video and tell people to leave comments based on what they see.

But it's going to be based on things that are only in one of the videos. So you can only if you see this comment, A, if you see this comment, B, you got you got version B of the video. Congrats. That's like that's going to be a thing. You can pump three crypto scams in one video. Can I share some thoughts? Please. I would like to make an analogy that people might understand because I feel like we're really in the weeds and maybe a lot of listeners might not be.

I want people to think of their Amazon shopping experience if you're an Amazon customer and how if you're searching for a product and you read the reviews, you see the ratings , you see the comments. On Amazon, you can actually swap the products that are listed on the page.

So you might see comments for a five star rated toothbrush, but then you go to the page and it's actually a completely different product. So if you think about it like that, how frustrating of an experience it is for the consumer to navigate what information is real, what information is important and like what am I actually seeing?

I literally cannot imagine it in imagine it in a video format. And I guess my question kind of is open ended is how much manipulation should a viewer reasonably expect when you're watching a video? At what point like the audience can't consent and doesn't know that these things are happening?

So who is this really benefiting? I'm not really it doesn't feel like it's going to benefit the viewer. I can tell you who I how I think this future came to be. I think that there's there's channels and I talk about like the the target audience for a channel all the time.

I think some of the best most interesting channels are nich ed down where, you know, you can imagine I'm I'm sitting in like my bedroom. I'm talking about like these baseball cards. I really like and behind me. I've got baseball memorabilia and I'm speaking English because that's the language that I speak and like all the things around me are very me.

And if you click on the video and you like that stuff, too, it's a small group. But that's a really good connection. Like, oh, you also like baseball cards and we're also speaking English and we also happen to have like the same taste and that's all great. And then there's like the mega channels whose goal is much more towards its mass appeal.

They're trying to appeal to as many people as possible. And these channels, you know, they love obviously the auto dubbing so that they can watch the video in any language and they love the dynamic thumbnails. So no matter who you are, no matter what you're interested in, you're going to get a thumbnail that appeals to you, even if it's not what really the creator is that into.

And so one by one, they're sort of like almost stripping away parts of the experience, like the title, like the language or whatever it is, and making it maximum appeal and maximum optimized. And that has allowed them to be successful in reaching more people, but with a product that's ever more, I don't know what the word is, like not sterile, but just kind of like generic, I guess.

And to them, that's a success. Boom. The numbers went up. Everything is more optimized. Hooray. And so for this video A-B test, it's literally like, well, if I upload a version that does worse and has a lesser retention curve, clearly I throw that one out because the one that got the better curve is the one that appeals to more people and the more numbers go up, we win.

I guess another concern kind of related to that I have is, since we don't know the guardrails for this, is this applicable to kids' YouTube content? Because that's a large concern that I have as well. That's a good question. I don't know if you can A-B test in kids' YouTube stuff yet with the thumbnails and titles yet.

I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of just questions. I feel like we just don't have enough answers. And yeah. Really, I was hoping Marques was going to come back from Made on YouTube with a little better answers. Because when I first thought of this, you said how they got here. And I can see their thought process of when you think of packaging, so often we think of title, thumbnail, and like first 10 seconds are kind of all in this, like, how to grab someone in a 20-second span from you're on your homepage to

watching a video. So if you think about that, if you do just A-B test an intro, maybe that applies to packaging. But if we don't know what the length of this is and can be two separate videos, then we're just in a world that I don 't know where, like, people could go with it and use it for misinformation and weird stuff.

And again, it's just focusing on this, like, weird, like, yo, what's your YouTube optimization stack? Well, I A-B test thumbnails, titles, and full videos. And I don't even care what they watch anymore. I just care that my view number goes up and I make money. You're just trying to stay on the platform, ultimately.

And I guess I'm not sure what the practical application of this would be other than ideally optimizing the beginning to keep retention. It's also, it's a world where, and maybe this is too far, but ultimately, you will never know why Google picked one version of a video versus another video.

It will ultimately be up to Google. And so they could say, like... The A-B test? Yeah. No. Yeah, well, you don't actually. You don't actually, though. No, the A-B test is, I assume it's just like thumbnails. You choose which version you want after the test is run.

Well, it will auto-choose, right, after it's run. You can have it auto-choose or you can choose. So basically, you upload up to three versions of it. And then what they'll give you is which one had each... They'll give you the watch time percentage or watch time share for each one and a graph of the retention graphs for each one.

And then you choose after which one you want to keep. So at the end of the day, there will only be one version of this video. At the end of the test. Yeah. So it won't be indefinitely. There are two versions of a video. Right. Okay. It'll eventually settle on one. 80% of the audience, which is usually in the first 48 hours , it could be two totally different videos.

If you are the kind of person who is just like so stoked about optimizing YouTube videos and getting tons of views and you decide like this is what you want to do, all respect to you, brother. Let me just tell you, though, being a professional YouTuber , it's not easy.

And there are plenty of great companies where you could do this for a living. RJ Reynolds, Philip Morris, Kulshi, DraftKings. These are all flagship American companies that you could work and just get f***ers addicted to whatever you want.

So why not just do that instead of having to do the hardest job ever and become a famous YouTuber? If you're going to this level, I think we are 10xing burnout in YouTube. Like if you are at the point where you are A-B testing titles, thumbnails and entire videos, you are just speed running burnout.

It's clearly a feature. And I think we said this earlier that it felt like maybe the top 1% somebody asked for X, Y and Z. And so this clearly is catering to that demographic and content strategist. I'm sorry, but I don't like it personally.

Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. Can I ask a question? Hmm? How are chapters going to work on two separate videos? Oh, my. It's a great question. They don't work at all. Thank you. They already don't work. They're already mostly broken. So they'll still be broken. They already don't work, Andrew.

Yeah. That's the thing. Maybe there'll be some guardrail that's like the videos have to be the same length. I don't even know if you can do that if you're testing two different. But what if I'm testing a quicker or shorter intro? It's always like one frame off. So maybe they'll have to be like within a few. Again, there's no current literature explaining any guardra ils for this.

Have they said when this is launching? At the event, they said early next year. You have time to change your mind. They have time to figure out. You can change your mind. It's okay to admit you're wrong. Yeah. Neil. Neil. Neil. Neil. Neil. This is what they want. Like they want everyone to be satisfied.

They want to like be able to produce as many videos as possible that have as much retention as possible because that means they can play another ad for every user. This is the only way that YouTube gets their watch time up. It's the only way they get the revenue up. This is what they're going to do. And I will just say.

It's in the late stage. There is like, again, videos have a utility and they have a entertainment value. Yeah. I don't know if you can imagine like going to a theater and watching a video and then your friend in another city saw the same movie and then you go to talk about it later in the comment section, if you will, and you guys saw different movies like that.

Well, they've done this. That feels broken. That has happened. That has happened, but they did it as like a social commentary thing. Okay. Yeah. So acknowledging that it was broken. Well, they did it on purpose to confuse people so that they would talk about the movie and be like, I didn't see that. What happened? Which movie are you thinking of? I don't remember. Was it a Netflix thing?

There was, well, there's choose your own adventure on Netflix. Yeah, that's different. There was the 1985 clue movie, which did notoriously have three different endings and everyone argued about which ending was the correct. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's what I was thinking about. Also at this point, to me, this really feels like the direction they're trying to push this in is like, why not just AI generate all the comments?

Like, like if we're already not sure what the real video is , who, who cares if you don't why not just create everyone their own individual little dopamine reality and keep them locked in there? That's the direction they're going for, bro. Why not just AI generate every video on YouTube? That's what they're going for.

What did Rufus say when we were talking about this at lunch ? He was like, it's just tube now. There's no more news. It's just the tube. I think the way they demonstrate the feature says a lot about how they expect people to use it and who it's for. And in, in their explanation of it, it was really just like , here is the retention graph for each of the three videos.

Now pick the one that you like the best based on the retention graph. And all you will learn from A-B testing is which one gave you the better retention graph. People will exploit this. And so now you are a retention graph machine. Basically. People will exploit this in ways that we cannot even fathom .

Yeah. So your, your learnings from using this feature will always be in the context of retention, retention, retention. And that's somebody's game. They love that game. Uh, but I do think it's valuable if you're a creator to ignore 90% of these features.

I do think that making a video and just getting the reps of making a video is far more valuable than, all right, I've made my video. Maybe I can optimize retention by recutting the intro. Maybe I can make three thumbnails. Maybe I can do this. I would just get reps at making the video.

So you get good at making videos. The rest of it is like filler and fluff. And at the top 1% in the name of, you know, maxing your audience or whatever it is, you can max your retention graphs. But I really would, I would strongly advise against using this very often.

If you're, especially if you're a beginning creator. Focus on retaining the light in your mother f***ing eye. Retention graph of the light in your eyes. I was going to say like, we're just, everything is going towards genericism and people follow creators not because they like appeal to the most people, but because they have a point of view and people like to follow people with points of view.

And everything that we're doing is just making things more palatable for more people. And I know that that keeps people on the platform longer. But like, you don't go see a movie by a certain director because everyone was like, it was fine. Because it has the best retention curve. What? You guys aren't going to the movies for that?

JJ Abrams leaving the movie 10 minutes after you sat down because you're bored? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Has anyone considered the viewer experience? Has anyone thought about the viewers? Somebody think of the viewers. I will say the entire keynote and all the presentations were very much not from the viewer experience other than the custom feeds thing.

The rest of it was like, here's your tool for how you make stuff to get the viewers to get the, you know, the retention graph and things like that. So that's the lens through most of, you know, the presentations. Marques, are you going to make me make four different videos? I was going to say. Tell me now.

So I did. I hopped on Colin and Samir's podcast briefly after and had a chat with them about the future. And Patty Galloway was next to me, famous for like, obviously he does a lot of this like retention maxing and innovation on this front, if you want to call it that. And his point was, and I think maybe this is the best argument for it, which was the argument against trying something new.

So if you're a, you're a longtime creator and you've been doing it the same way over and over and over and over again, and you have this idea of like, what if I did a little montage in the intro? I kind of like that idea, but I don't, I don't know if my audience would like that. I've never done that before. Maybe I'll try it.

And you do an AB test of like, here's a version with it. Here's a version without it. We see the version with it bombed and everybody hated it. And you confirmed, okay, yeah, it doesn't really work. Or you get surprisingly positive comments and everybody's loving it. And you're like, damn, I can try this.

I can do this new thing. That was the positive argument I heard, which is like, it encourages you maybe at some point along the line to try something new that you wouldn't have tried. But I do think here, we typically have pretty good conviction about what we're making, why we're making it and what we want it to do and say.

And so I rarely feel the need to like, oh, should I say this about this product? Like everything I'm saying in the video, I wanted to say about the thing. Just try the new thing. Yeah, you try the new thing. It just means half the people see the new thing. It is scary. You're still trying and putting it out there.

I agree. It is scary because there are creators where it's like, if I try this new thing and I don't maybe test it and I just send it and it bombs, I don't get that one back. And maybe I make one video a month. No, you learn a valuable lesson from it. I also agree. Yeah. But you learn that valuable lesson siloed off in a way that you can maybe just go, okay, it's good to go.

Or, okay, actually, it's not good to go. I have a question. Yeah. Do you feel like this, well, yeah, in this scenario, because I don't think people are going to do that, but in this scenario, do you think this is like the solution to people having secondary channels? Because there's a lot of people who I feel like are scared to try new stuff and then they do create a secondary channel.

Like I'm thinking of like a Danny Gonzalez. I'm thinking a lot of people who maybe, yeah, they're known for one thing, but they would like to try something new. Jarvis Johnson. Like that is the best case scenario to keeping it all on one branded channel instead of making subsidiaries. Yeah.

I will say I think a lot of creators don't have as much team help and don't have as much bandwidth. So creating a second channel is more of an undertaking. And maybe we take it for granted here that we can just spin up a channel and have the resources for it.

But I think to some extent there are people who are like, it's just me and one editor. And like, I kind of want to try a montage intro for this podcast I did, but I don't know. I've never done that before. I don't know if people are going to like it. I'll just do it. Maybe I'll just send it for the AB test.

It's the most earnest way to try this. It's the most generous interpretation of the use of that feature I can imagine. I mean, as much as I agree with Andrew, like you should, you should go for it. Like that's part of the part of the cool part of doing this for a living is that you are empowered to like go for it.

You know, that being said, that is like the use of this that seems like acceptable. I just think if you really want to try something, it should be because you think it's cool and you want to try it. Because you personally want to do it. If your audience hates it, then get the feedback and be like, they hate it because of this.

I hadn't thought of that. Maybe I don't. I'm not as convinced. Or you could be like, that was sick. And I thought that was awesome. And some people might not like it, but I'm going to keep doing it. Some people will. Yeah. That's cool. And that honestly, the more I think about it, like that's kind of how it's gone forever and how I kind of think it should go, which is like you try something new.

A bunch of the audience hates it, unsubscribes, leaves, but you loved it. That's why you made it. Okay, great. You've shedded the audience that didn't like that old stuff and you're growing and you get new audience that likes the new stuff that you're trying. And so your channel isn't always going to grow and grow and grow.

We all want to max. We all want to optimize. But sometimes you just got to evolve. And this is a way of, you know, this A-B test feature will be a way to like try to stay perfect and hopefully never have a blemish. But sometimes growth is learned through mistakes.

Actually, it usually is learned through mistakes. And so you just got to try new stuff. Fail sometimes, win sometimes. That's how you like evolve as a creator. Just take the L. Yeah. Yeah. Or the W. Or the W. Or the W. And brands notably change their logos all the time. We dunk on them all the time.

Yeah. Which is true because oftentimes they're bad. But if you don't change your brand, your branding, your website, whatever, you would like people eventually fade into irrelevance. Like people, people will to different creators, to different types of content, they'll be saying, man, they've been doing the same thing for like 10 years.

They haven't changed at all. And some people like that. But honestly, you should be adapting your content to what you want to do next, what you want to try next. And if you never, ever, ever change, people get tired of that and they just like fade out. Yeah. So I don't know.

Try the new stuff. But don't make 12 versions of the same video. Yeah. It's crazy. Don't make your editor edit three. Yeah. I was going to say that. If we've learned anything here. All right. Let's make three separate podcasts and we'll release them. Yeah. Adam, I forgot to tell you. We're going to ABC test this podcast later.

We're going to do three podcasts a week, but only release one. Anyway, that is our existential thoughts. I think that's about all. That's about it. We have a round table. Trivia stuff. Yeah. Well, we could talk about that next week, right? There's other stuff. The round table.

The onion stuff is not worth talking about. Okay. After all this. We'll save the onion stuff. Save the onion story. We'll save the onion stuff. Comment onions if you want to hear about onions next week. Make me cry, bro. And we'll A-B test the onions versus no onions. Okay. In other news, trivia time.

That was long. I hope you guys enjoy it. I'm just going to start making A-B test jokes about everything. Mariah, I told you you'd be doing a trivia question today. And you were like, what are you talking about? I'm not on the pod today. This is really stressful. And I was like, you just wait and see.

Was Mariah paying attention? But first, it's my trivia question. Guys, we talked about a chip made with a two nanometer process. Two nanometers is about as wide as a strand of what? First of all, you were lying to me.

But here I am. I was not lying. Is it a lie if it ended up being the truth? No. No, that sounds like the truth. You manifested this. I don't know how you did it. It just means you were wrong. Emphasis on what? The transistor scale video.

It was hovering next to my head. But see, Marquez, I have something called intuition. I think we all got the right answer. I think he worded it in a way where if you say anything else, we're going to think about it a little. Okay, good. Yeah. We all said DNA. And you're all correct.

I should have made the question harder. If you didn't say strand. I agree. If you didn't say strand. I think there was room. Strand had the opportunity to throw off because everything compares to a strand of human hair. Yes. And I will say I started thinking of animals that may have thinner hair than humans, which is a really dumb move.

And then I remembered DNA. Does anyone know anything else that's two nanometers wide? We are very close to a single atom. We are so close. But not quite there. Yeah. All right. Do you know? Wait, you got to tell us. Adam's gone.

He's like, no one knows where he went. Adam's actually been standing behind the camera the entire time. Adam's literally disappeared. He's not here, which means I get to do the score update today. I didn't gain anything. Everyone got one point. He did. Which means. Dang it. David, you now have 13 points.

This is bull****. Insane. We could ABC test this to where each of us are winning. And therefore it only feeds to the people who like specific posts. Never mind. Adam had already updated the score by the time I started reading it. So I was incorrect. David, you have 12 points.

How did Adam know that I won already? I don't know. Oh. Andrew, you have seven points in the middle. And Marquez. How would you say that? Go ahead. You have three points. Thank you.

For this next one, can we get one point for each letter? No. Think about it. Think about it. Yes. Yes. Wait. There we go. What? I forgot what the question was. Yeah. I've been thinking about it this whole time. Question number two. We're going to A-B test. We love acronyms here at the Waveform Podcast.

So what time does APV and APV codec stand for? What time? That's what you wrote. I know I'm not. Bro. What time? What time? 426. What is it? Just what does APV stand for? What is APV? I'm wrong.

Burgundy? That doesn't make me look foolish. You wrote this. P? AVP. APV. Oh. Codec. What does APV stand for? APV. If you don't know.

I'm spelling something wrong. Dang. All right, gamers. One for each letter? One for each letter. I just wrote a bunch of words that might be good for that letter. Adam says yes. You get one per letter.

You get correct. All right. Oh. Somebody want to read what they have? We were close. What did you write? Advanced Precision Video. Oh. I wrote advanced professional video codec. David, what did you say?

That was right? The whole thing? Scott. But only in this version of the video. What did you write, David? Audio. Parallelized.

Video. I've never seen that word. Boom. Which that means I got two points. So, David got, oh, you're in perfect order. One, two, three points. Yeah, one, two, three. Yeah. That is incredible. That actually fits. That's so useful. That's really good for the program. Yes, the evener. That's so good.

Wow, wait. I should have. I literally read the article this morning and then I am the one that added the acronym in the document. Wow. Frank. You're like, yeah, I wrote that question. I, I, I. All right. Great pod, everyone.

Yep. To everyone listening, depending on which version of this podcast you're listening to. I'm sorry. Or you're welcome. I'm so serious. This is going to be like, people are going to end up being like, if you got this far on the podcast, comment onions. But in the other two, it'll say, if you got this far on the podcast, comment grapes or potatoes.

The only thing we change of every episode. Everyone's like, why is everyone saying grapes? It clearly says onions. Anyway. It should make it rough. Yeah. Thanks for watching. Leave your comments on what sort of other things people will do with A-B testing videos down below. And we'll catch you guys. Is next week still Tech-Tember? Yeah.

Holy moly. Yes, it is. Wake me up when Tech-Tember ends. Catch you guys. The end of Tech-Tember. Actually, technically, by the time they watch it, it will be October 1st. Roadster Day. Okay, cool. Well. We will record it. Roadster Day, my ass. Okay. Roadster Day in the other version of it. I still have the light in my eyes.

I still have the light in my eyes. Really? Wayform is produced by Adam Molina and Ellis Rovin. We are part of the Vox Media Podcast Network and a triad of your music was created by Vain Sill. Also, Mariah is here and get used to her because she's going to be here a lot for the next month and a half. And you ain't going to see Adam in a bit.

So say bye-bye. We didn't fire him though. I'm Adam now. Except for next week. You actually won't be here next week. But Adam is just in the version of the video you're not watching.

I was going to say your mom, but then I was like, wait, that's really small. And as we know. They're running a cover two defense. But you're running to get game day deals on Uber Eats.

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